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Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - Printable Version

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+---- Thread: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows (/showthread.php?tid=223175)

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RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - rexian - 2019-02-09

While Kodi 18 has many under the hood features, I am not sure for non-developers those are big deals - at least not until new addons / skins start taking advantage of those. For me personally, this 14 months old Kodi 17.6 DSPlayer build works pretty well with MadVR and 1050 TI. It's the fear of the current skins/addons not working after a while is why I keep checking this thread... Undecided

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - oldpainless - 2019-02-09

Me personally, will stick with Dsplayer.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - gujal - 2019-02-09

Is there any chance of a 18.0 DSPlayer build at all, please?
Kodi 17.6 DSPlayer does most things but it sorely lacks on playing DRM content. Inputstream Adaptive has grown leaps and bounds on the Kodi 18 stream that most Official Catchup TV, Netflix and Amazon Prime now work on 18 using the widevine DRM module in conjunction with Inputstream Adaptive. It would be fantastic if aracnoz comes back from his sabbatical and works on DSPlayer 18 Big Grin

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - Warner306 - 2019-02-09

No point in asking because you won't get a reply.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - Warner306 - 2019-02-09

I stuck it out two years with Jarvis. I will probably do the same with Krypton. The new DRM features are interesting, but besides that there isn't much going in v18 that interests me. The instability I've been reading about in v18 surrounding changing refresh rates and resuming from sleep also sound bothersome compared to Krypton. Especially if one were to use any external players.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - ashlar - 2019-02-09

(2019-02-09, 15:01)Warner306 Wrote: I stuck it out two years with Jarvis. I will probably do the same with Krypton. The new DRM features are interesting, but besides that there isn't much going in v18 that interests me. The instability I've been reading about in v18 surrounding changing refresh rates and resuming from sleep also sound bothersome compared to Krypton. Especially if one were to use any external players.
Semi-offtopic here but... Warner306, do you know whether Kodi Leia supports HDR10 under Windows in its regular builds? I'm investigating the best solution for a friend of mine (he needs Windows for non-Kodi reasons) and I'd try to avoid DSPlayer for ease of use, etc.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - Warner306 - 2019-02-09

No, maybe this year they will add support for manual HDR selection by toggling the Windows HDR switch. Windows has to change to make this automatic and it may take a long time for that to occur. New Windows features tend to trickle in a little at a time and I can't see HDR video playback as being a huge concern for the foreseeable future. Windows is not really a home theatre operating system and HDR computer monitors are in short supply.

MPC for HDR content alone combined with regular Kodi is the best solution for HDR passthrough if DSPlayer isn't desirable and Windows is the required operating system. LibreELEC Linux may get support for automatic HDR passthrough before Windows. There is supposed to be an attempt to add support this year.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - brazen1 - 2019-02-09

I'm using KODI 18.1 x64 with external players.  I haven't experienced any instabilities (except iso stacking which I've never used past or present) or found anything bothersome reported by others since they were addressed prior to the final release.  Refresh rate matching or postage stamp resize is not an issue here anymore fwiw.  Maybe many of the problems still reported are unique to some users approaches vs others?  Just want to emphasize there are SUCCESS stories too.  I see no reason others should be told to shy away from upgrading especially those who might consider using external players.

I've welcomed many of the new additions v.18.1 x64 offers.  UHD HDR playback with VideoPlayer for one.  Ashlar has asked if LEIA handles HDR10.  For me it does.  Butter smooth, great clarity, saturation, highlights and color.  It looks exceptional actually although I prefer an external player with a madVR renderer to passthrough HDR using a private API - nVidia.  My CPU is 10 yrs old.  So is my MB and RAM.  I have DXVA2 enabled and pixel shaders set as the renderer.  I don't toggle any O/S HDR switch off or on.  It's always off.  Using a blind test, I'd bet many of you wouldn't notice using KODI's internal VideoPlayer vs DSPlayer, or any other players tbh.  Yet for those like myself seeking absolute perfection, no single player is going to cut the mustard.  A combination of players will though and you will be state-of-the-art keeping up with the times and all it offers.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - Warner306 - 2019-02-09

I'm not sure what us DSPlayer users are supposed to be jealous of. v18 isn't that much of an upgrade outside of a few features that may be of no interest to some here. Since v18 released, there have been more bug reports than v17. You said you weren't having any issues with Kodi resizing after switching refresh rates, but that was with one skin, Aeon Nox Silvo. What about those who prefer other skins?
 
(2019-02-09, 21:19)brazen1 Wrote: I've welcomed many of the new additions v.18.1 x64 offers.  UHD HDR playback with VideoPlayer for one.  Ashlar has asked if LEIA handles HDR10.  For me it does.  Butter smooth, great clarity, saturation, highlights and color.

Yes, but I have conversed with a Kodi developer that said Kodi is using simple Reinhard tone mapping designed for digital photography and not video. I know the color isn't accurate because there is no saturation correction and no gamut mapping with hue preservation. Team Kodi doesn't have a tone mapping expert on-hand. It is also still HDR -> SDR and not true HDR passthrough.
 
(2019-02-09, 21:19)brazen1 Wrote: Using a blind test, I'd bet many of you wouldn't notice using KODI's internal VideoPlayer vs DSPlayer, or any other players tbh.  Yet for those like myself seeking absolute perfection, no single player is going to cut the mustard.  A combination of players will though and you will be state-of-the-art keeping up with the times and all it offers.

I've taken the test maybe a 100 times. Not blind, but even 1080p -> 1080p is definitely not identical. That's how I ended up using MPC with madVR in the first place. I was used to watching Blu-rays with a PS3 Blu-ray player. Moving to Kodi, I didn't like the softer picture and ended up using madVR. It depends on whether you have a trained brain and know what to look for. Going from one player that you like to another can be jarring when you realize over time that the picture has changed. A short-term, blind test doesn't give most eyes enough time to adjust. You can also do more now to enhance even native sources with video shaders, simple things like supersampling, for example.

I would miss DSPlayer the most for Internet streaming video content. I watch 720p streams from YouTube, the CBC.ca add-on with its 171 shows and Twitch daily. I don't know how anyone could fail to see the difference between Pixel Shaders with Lanczos3 - Optimized versus madVR with NGU Sharp very high + SSIM 1D 100% downscaling. Even at a mere 720p -> 1080p, the latter is sharper and cleaner. The image is considerably cleaner with fewer artifacts.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - madjockxbmc - 2019-02-10

(2019-02-09, 21:19)brazen1 Wrote: I'm using KODI 18.1 x64 with external players.  I haven't experienced any instabilities (except iso stacking which I've never used past or present) or found anything bothersome reported by others since they were addressed prior to the final release.  Refresh rate matching or postage stamp resize is not an issue here anymore fwiw.  Maybe many of the problems still reported are unique to some users approaches vs others?  Just want to emphasize there are SUCCESS stories too.  I see no reason others should be told to shy away from upgrading especially those who might consider using external players.

I've welcomed many of the new additions v.18.1 x64 offers.  UHD HDR playback with VideoPlayer for one.  Ashlar has asked if LEIA handles HDR10.  For me it does.  Butter smooth, great clarity, saturation, highlights and color.  It looks exceptional actually although I prefer an external player with a madVR renderer to passthrough HDR using a private API - nVidia.  My CPU is 10 yrs old.  So is my MB and RAM.  I have DXVA2 enabled and pixel shaders set as the renderer.  I don't toggle any O/S HDR switch off or on.  It's always off.  Using a blind test, I'd bet many of you wouldn't notice using KODI's internal VideoPlayer vs DSPlayer, or any other players tbh.  Yet for those like myself seeking absolute perfection, no single player is going to cut the mustard.  A combination of players will though and you will be state-of-the-art keeping up with the times and all it offers.
This all makes no sense, you say you have no problems with the final release yet you are using 18.1, and if you think UHD playback is ok, then you are quite mad. Smile
EDIT : Just tried latest nightly in Portable mode and a couple of UHD HDR remux files. It is far from fluid and with Pixel shaders the colours are blown out and all too bright, so unsure what you used to say it is fine for the most part.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - brazen1 - 2019-02-10

Warner, I have great respect for you and your technical expertise but I feel like I've intruded on sacred ground or something?  I'm going to make an attempt to reply and please don't find my words offensive.

You have a user asking if v.18 will handle HDR10.  The reply was no.  I'm a v.18.1 (and a former v.18 user not that it makes any difference) and I can play it with my antiquated hardware and it looks very good considering.  Coming from someone who actually uses it, I thought it helpful and provided settings with a brief description of my environment.  Somehow, you've taken my input regarding it nothing more than an attempt to make DSP users jealous with no ammo.  And all this time I thought it was ok to compare notes from time to time even if it contradicts another's results.  I simply stated an honest testimonial.  I understand now this isn't a good idea here.  It won't happen again.

You made it a point to state v.18 is too unstable and has problems especially with external players noting matching refresh rates and postage stamping off the top of your head.  That you will probably sit on 17.1 for a couple years longer since v.18 offers nothing new or appealing to you.  v.18 did have these problems during alpha, beta, and RC stages.  Eventually they were addressed along with many other bugs.  I know.  I reported them because they affected me.  I don't have the exact nightly version that addressed them but I can safely say the bugs are no longer present in the final release or the new 18.1 nightlies.  I understand this contradicts your findings but these are mine.  You also stated v.18 has more bug reports than v.17.  I don't find that surprising.  Every build for a decade or longer was only working with 1080p SDR at best leading up to a v.17 pinnacle.  Along comes 2160p HDR, a pretty huge advancement for the world let alone what v.18 had to adjust to vs what v.17 had to adjust to.  Of course dealing with a new higher resolution and HDR is going to create more bugs to work out.  v.17 didn't have to deal with anything like this.

I don't get one-off results because I only use one specific skin.  Any skin in the official KODI repo works perfectly.  I tested all of them searching for an appropriate new skin for myself since my former skin was problematic and was not going to be addressed any longer.  Those that aren't in the official repo (I tested about 10 of the most popular), all failed at the time I tested except for silvo's one lone skin that isn't in the repository.  Why only it's ok, I don't know and I don't care anymore.  So, v.18 isn't broken imo.  The skins were and may still be.  If v.18 wants to adjust to the broken skins, have at it but common sense tells me it should be the other way around.  I posted all of this in detail in another thread at the time, even reaching out with some PM's but it always fell on deaf ears and I assumed no one must be being affected but me.  Now that v.18 is here, I see I wasn't alone.  My suggestion is always test official releases using Estuary since the devs do.

I'm fully aware v.18 is HDR>SDR.  That there are other methods to get passthrough which imo, are better.  I sort of stated that in my post along with I prefer other players rather than just the KODI VideoPlayer.  I don't fail to see a difference using madVR algorithms vs KODI's.  Why would you suggest I do?  MadVR vs KODI is not what's in question.  KODI abilities, not qualities are.  Your OP made that clear.  That said, I still stand behind v.18 HDR>SDR looks very, very good considering and that plenty of folks would never notice the difference HDR passed through vs HDR converted to SDR.  We as enthusiasts do but casual users... not so much imo.  They aren't watching the software.  They're just watching the movie. 

To gawk at KODI's solution is disrespectful.  To pick it apart and compare to madVR challenges casual users into shying away from even using KODI convinced it will be problematic with horrible results or worse... that KODI isn't compatible with UHD HDR at all by telling them "no" because it doesn't passthrough.  Many of these folks are just searching for a way to play UHD HDR and they don't have computer science degrees nor the ambition to seek every last ounce of quality and performance.  They just want to know if they can watch UHD on their TV somehow and ran across KODI while searching around. 

I for one would encourage them and I base that on my own personal findings.  Whether the same could be true for everyone I don't know?  There's too many variables but if it works for some, it can work for others.  The post above this one is a prime example.  Because he doesn't get the results I do, I'm a liar, I make no sense, and I'm quite mad.  Thanks for that btw.  Ask yourself, if v.18 didn't handle UHD HDR decently, do you really think it would have released despite?  Plopping a non-delivering unwatchable new build after years of careful development with all platforms considered just for the sake of dishing something out whether it works or not?  No, of course not yet you're convinced that's what has occurred.  Don't know what to tell you.  I tried.  All I've managed is to be made to look like an ass.  Maybe a couple pics will help back up what I write.  These are both v.18.1 VideoPlayer with nothing additional and O/S HDR is turned off as it always is.  I think the 2nd screenshot looks pretty decent but if you still find it far from looking ok, then it is what it is.  You don't need to tell me madVR rendered players look better again.  That's why I use them.  Ashlar, I can't guarantee you will get the same results for your friend.  I can only provide my own experience and hope it helps and encourages you.

Here is what you describe madjockxbmc:

Image



And here is what I've been discussing:


Image

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - madjockxbmc - 2019-02-10

@brazen1 

Unsure why you are getting your panties in a twist, I think Warners reply makes a lot of sense, mine was obviously a tad sarcastic, but it seems you are the one overreacting in a way, there are multiple new threads with people with audio issues, video issues, but you say there was no difference between 18 and 18.1 when we know fine well there were issues with many things.

You say why would they release 18 without HDR working correctly and Warner has replied saying at what level of tone mapping they have made in the HDR->SDR side, it is very limited, if your answer to the question,  can it play UHD HDR files, then Yes is an answer, but it plays them badly, so to me I think Warner is quite correct, it is at a very early stage and needs a lot of improvement. I tried VLC this afternoon and it even plays them better.

You also say there are better ways to get passthrough, but thats the point, there is no way to get passthrough, so it is a very basic HDR-SDR change which looks worse than Bluray, unsure why you could say anything different ?

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - mclingo - 2019-02-11

I also have the same awful HDR picture in 18.1, as a side issue, MPC-BE does a decent enough HDR to SDR conversion and has done for a while.

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - ashlar - 2019-02-11

Thanks for the replies and sorry to see my question has raised a fuss.

When I asked "does Leia support HDR10" I implied "support it correctly". Tone mapping it to SDR does not qualify for "support", in my view. But I understand the point and I should have been clearer.
For all intents and purposes the answer to my question is "no". And I'm quite baffled, to be honest. I'll leave it at that, as i don't want to ruffle any more feathers than the ones I've already ruffled, now and in the past.

Thanks again to all that replied. Smile

RE: Kodi DSPlayer – DirectShow Player for Windows - madjockxbmc - 2019-02-11

I think the scary part is and Warner touched on this, it would most likely have to use Windows HDR, and if you do have to use that, and they don't allow it to be switchable in the future, then no one wants that abomination on their desktop all the time.