[majorsl]

I will do limited channel surfing, so the slow changes are only peripherally annoying to me. Once I settle on a channel with a string of shows I'll watch or for background noise, I've had it stream to an XBMC client for 8+ hours without hiccup.

By far, our biggest use is as a PVR. We had NextPVR in the livingroom before I expanded to XBMC to other locations, and the scheduling for NextPVR was top notch.

Personally, I'd like more robust scheduling options from the plugins. At least scheduling re-occurring recordings short term.

Have you tried http://forums.gbpvr.com/showthread.php?t=52756
[X-NEWA] Read me first

Sure have, and it's fantastic! But, because it's built to use NextPVR's NEWA, it can be a little slow at times and occasionally loses connection to NPVR - a Refresh fixes it.

With that said, having all the features of a PVR in a single location is preferable.

[negge]

I just reinstalled my server (I managed to break Linux completely) and migrated back to Frodo and to my surprise channel switching is a lot faster than in Gotham. Granted it could have something to do with the re-install, though all the configs remain the same (naturally I backed everything up before reinstalling).

[awp0]

I think it's funny that people claim channel surfing is "unintelligent", especially during this time of year.

Here we are in the summer months, with very few popular shows currently playing new episodes. I agree that in the fall and winter months my DVR is full and I rarely watch any "live" TV except for sports. But this time of year I find myself channel surfing just to find something remotely interesting to watch. Sure, I could spend hours researching new shows and maybe I'd find more interesting content to record in advance, but the channel surfing approach is satisfying and low effort, making it the "intelligent" choice for me. Also, I like using XBMC for this because it's a consistent and attractive UI, and also because I can play it through my three different XBMC-connected TV's.

FWIW, Windows works fine as a backend. I'm running it with ArgusTV. The only problems I encounter is when Comcast changes my QAM channel lineup. I'm not sure that any single user's poor experience with one OS/backend combination should lead to the conclusion that the OS is a poor choice for everyone. My channel change times are probably 2-3 seconds. I think the initial tuning is longer, maybe 5 seconds.

[tential]

My point was to start some debate over how we use our PVRs - but why do you use PVR if you are channel surfing and watching Live TV? Why not just watch the damn TV?

I record lots of stuff, but also like to watch tv and channel surf, and I like to be able to pause and rewind live tv. I'm sure lots of people do the same. There is no reason why they should have to leave XBMC to watch tv. Some people may also not have pause/rewind live tv features when they "just watch the damn tv", so doing it through XBMC may give them some additional benefits.

XBMC already does these things, so we're really just talking about some adding some polish.

This.

I just got my dad to get me a Ceton InfiniTV 4 after my cousin wanted a ton of Kids stuff recorded. She's going back to Ghana and wants some TV shows for her kids to watch. So I can PVR just about everything for her, but I would PREFER xbmc to be the main way you interact with the TV. If I don't have to use the box, I don't have to use the terribly slow TVguide I get from FIOS, I can easily switch from TV to movies/episode I already have stored, and I can easily grow my library.

Why wouldn't I use this?

[sparticle]

nickr,

I am 100% with you. My ideal would be to only watch timeshitfted content. we are probably 90% there now. I am working on the other 10%. We generally have 10 plus XBMC devices on the lan, Ubuntu, ATV2, Android and now Rpi clients. Everything is still a bit clunky on the PVR front. The XBMC excluding livetv/MythTV setup is solid. c.8TB of Movies/TV Shows, Enterprise grade NAS server at the centre of the system. XBMC's are clients only no local media stored.

When I bring in livetv then things are a but flaky, (only to be expected with the immaturity of the SW) and not quite ready for the big time but the promise is there. One big issue is the integration with the backend. In my case MythTVbackend which has the Sat card on a Ubuntu 12.04.2 box. I only want one repository of TV show and Video content that is the NAS. When I record something using MythTV (not livetv which I am happy to be managed by the MYthTVbackend) that is the start of a convoluted process to get it into my XBMC TVSHOW library after having to rename the numeric MythTV filenames sensibly and then scan them into the library (there does not seem to be a way to automate this in MythTV). Surely I can't be the only xbmc user that wants this automated. I want to use XBMC as the control point (whichever XBMC I happen to be using at the time to schedule and manage recordings). I only want to see those episode recordings in my TVSHOW library along with the other TVSHOW Episodes. Then this will really be a true PVR that is family friendly and does not rely on years of experience using linux and PC's etc. Example would be current X-Factor series broadcast on Freesat ITV currently recordings show up under LIveTV and are the original MPEG/TS streams recorded by MythTVbackend residing in the MythTVbackend recordings directory instead of a transcoded MP4 file that is half the size sitting as /NAS/The X Factor/Series 10/X-Factor.S10E06.SD.Arena Auditions 3.mp4 and showing up under TV Shows!

Live tv is a nice to have for the occasional use we have for it. My wife, kids, guests etc. all get the XBMC thing and expect to be watching timeshifted content. We now have no other way for them to watch TV having got rid of the multiroom sky+HD boxes saving myself 800 Quid a year and reclaiming 2x1TB AV drives I have not even rolled out the PVR addon yet. If I can get all recorded content sensibly into the library they don't need it!

My two penneth
Spart

[negge]

Your issue with recordings is not XBMC's fault, it's the backend's. What you need is tell the backend how to name the recordings and where to store them. If you want to get fancy you can tell the backend to update XBMC's library after a recording is finished.

[teeedubb]

nickr,

I am 100% with you. My ideal would be to only watch timeshitfted content. we are probably 90% there now. I am working on the other 10%. We generally have 10 plus XBMC devices on the lan, Ubuntu, ATV2, Android and now Rpi clients. Everything is still a bit clunky on the PVR front. The XBMC excluding livetv/MythTV setup is solid. c.8TB of Movies/TV Shows, Enterprise grade NAS server at the centre of the system. XBMC's are clients only no local media stored.

When I bring in livetv then things are a but flaky, (only to be expected with the immaturity of the SW) and not quite ready for the big time but the promise is there. One big issue is the integration with the backend. In my case MythTVbackend which has the Sat card on a Ubuntu 12.04.2 box. I only want one repository of TV show and Video content that is the NAS. When I record something using MythTV (not livetv which I am happy to be managed by the MYthTVbackend) that is the start of a convoluted process to get it into my XBMC TVSHOW library after having to rename the numeric MythTV filenames sensibly and then scan them into the library (there does not seem to be a way to automate this in MythTV). Surely I can't be the only xbmc user that wants this automated. I want to use XBMC as the control point (whichever XBMC I happen to be using at the time to schedule and manage recordings). I only want to see those episode recordings in my TVSHOW library along with the other TVSHOW Episodes. Then this will really be a true PVR that is family friendly and does not rely on years of experience using linux and PC's etc. Example would be current X-Factor series broadcast on Freesat ITV currently recordings show up under LIveTV and are the original MPEG/TS streams recorded by MythTVbackend residing in the MythTVbackend recordings directory instead of a transcoded MP4 file that is half the size sitting as /NAS/The X Factor/Series 10/X-Factor.S10E06.SD.Arena Auditions 3.mp4 and showing up under TV Shows!

Live tv is a nice to have for the occasional use we have for it. My wife, kids, guests etc. all get the XBMC thing and expect to be watching timeshifted content. We now have no other way for them to watch TV having got rid of the multiroom sky+HD boxes saving myself 800 Quid a year and reclaiming 2x1TB AV drives I have not even rolled out the PVR addon yet. If I can get all recorded content sensibly into the library they don't need it!

My two penneth
Spart

Use mythlink.pl to symlink your recordings to human readable filenames, then import the recordings into the xbmc library.

[nickr]

Your issue with recordings is not XBMC's fault, it's the backend's. What you need is tell the backend how to name the recordings and where to store them. If you want to get fancy you can tell the backend to update XBMC's library after a recording is finished.

Well first you might want to commflag the recording, and write an EDL file from the database entries. mythfrontend uses the database for the ad break points, but xbmc can make use of an EDL file.

[negge]

Your issue with recordings is not XBMC's fault, it's the backend's. What you need is tell the backend how to name the recordings and where to store them. If you want to get fancy you can tell the backend to update XBMC's library after a recording is finished.

Well first you might want to commflag the recording, and write an EDL file from the database entries. mythfrontend uses the database for the ac break points, but xbmc can make use of an EDL file.

I've never used MythTV myself so most of those terms fly right over me.

[sparticle]

Use mythlink.pl to symlink your recordings to human readable filenames, then import the recordings into the xbmc library.

teeedubb,

I guess the point I am making is that I want XBMC to be the control point for all of my media. It currently is for DVDS/TVSHOWS/PICTURES/MUSIC integrated with SIckbeard and Sab etc. This thread was all about what are your expectations for a PVR. In my ideal system:

XBMC would schedule any recordings from MythTVbackend using the MythTV PVR addon EPG (seems to work great so far)
MythTVbackend would record and transcode the scheduled TV shows -> output would be a mp4 file named showname.SeriesNNEpisodeNN.EpisodeTitle.mp4
Something would then automatically pickup that file from a watch folder and place it in the correct TVSHOW/SERIES folder on the NAS then update XBMC accordingly to get metadata etc. (Maybe SIckbeard)
XBMC would then be used to watch the episode from the TV Shows menu (of course it would pop up in the latest tv shows as well)

MythTVbackend is exactly that a BACKEND only providing a recording service to XBMC LIVETV is exactly that and is irrelevant to this thread. I will never run MythTVfrontend or any other client than XBMC. Maybe the devs could add another menu option to the MythTV PVR addon that asks if the user wants XBMC to be the control point for MythTVbackend if so then you could configure all the goodness I have outlined above at the XBMC end, I would not see the Recordings sub menu and all my TV recordings would appear under TV Shows or Movies. If no then you get what is configured at the MythTVbackend like now.

I do not know how to achieve the above without being a programmer etc. mythink.pl does not achieve the above, I don't want to symlink anything. I want to record the show using MythTVbackend transcode it from MPEG/TS to MP4 to reduce file size etc. rename it to a format that XBMC understands and can scrape from TheTVDB api move it to my TVSHOWS directory and update XBMC accordingly all controlled from the XBMC front end

The above would be a true PVR that is fully integrated. Making XBMC PVR usage a doddle for Wife/Kids/Guests etc. They watch TV in one place Record it in the same place manage their TVSHOWS in the same place etc.

It seems that the MythTVbackend web service/api is capable of being used to configure the above, maybe the devs for the PVR addon think this is too much of a challenge.

For me XBMC rules, and I want to do all I can within XBMC and let it manage the various backends etc.

Sorry for the rant.

Cheers
Spart

[teeedubb]

Yes but you can make mythtv do all that via user jobs.

[negge]

@sparticle: XBMC can tell the backend to record things. That's a feature. If the backend can't name and move that recording the way you want it's a bug in the backend, not in XBMC. I don't really understand what you're expecting from XBMC here.

[nickr]

A backend user script can do all of that, but of course you can also watch mythtv episodes from the XBMC PVR addon. Trancoding does use a lot of resources though. A larger hard drive may be more practical.

The programme name, episode etc are all available for renaming purposes.

Frankly the PVR addon doesn't have all the options for setting up mythtv recordings, if you want to use any of the useful options you need the frontend (which is a very nice piece of software) or mythweb, which you can operate from any web browser.

By the way mp4 is crap compared to mkv.

The other thing is, wht scrape for data that mythtv has already scraped?

[teeedubb]

Frankly the PVR addon doesn't have all the options for setting up mythtv recordings, if you want to use any of the useful options you need the frontend (which is a very nice piece of software) or mythweb, which you can operate from any web browser.

Exactly. Even if xbmc could control every aspect of scheduling recordings I would still use myth web as I find its easier to do with a keyboard/mouse or with a touch screen.

[sparticle]

Frankly the PVR addon doesn't have all the options for setting up mythtv recordings, if you want to use any of the useful options you need the frontend (which is a very nice piece of software) or mythweb, which you can operate from any web browser.

Exactly. Even if xbmc could control every aspect of scheduling recordings I would still use myth web as I find its easier to do with a keyboard/mouse or with a touch screen.

But I am sure that those missing options could be added to the PVR client right? Like record this program every week etc.

I am sure 'you' find mythweb fine I think it's very easy to use..... but not my wife or kids! They want to point and click in xbmc and hey presto!

Are there user job scripts available that I can setup to do what I want? If so can you point me in the right direction. I have read most of the MythTV wiki and found mythlink and mythexport etc. A lot of this stuff is like the black arts!!!

Again the whole point of this thread was what are your expectations of a PVR. I am not blaming or attacking XBMC I think it's the best piece of software for media centre out there and I have been using it for a long time. I have made my families expectations pretty clear (believe me they made their feeling clear to me ). Now I just have to figure out how to achieve it without having to be a computer science expert! I don't really care about mp4 vs mkv if mkv is better great I'll use that as XBMC will play it, Handbrake will churn it out. From memory we did have some issues in the past that the PS3's didn't play mkv files so maybe that is why we started using mp4 files I can't really remember. In respect of a bigger disk. The drive that MythTVbackend uses is a dedicated 1TB AV drive. The media NAS has 16TB Raid 12 usable 8 used.

You guys clearly have the computer hacking skills to understand how to achieve what we want from a PVR. My drive is unification and integration, the drive out there in the world is unification look at your smartphone, now also an XBMC client (hurrah). XBMC on my HP CM10 Touchpad is awesome. Removing the SKY boxes was a huge leap forward. If we can get the Rpi's working then they will probably be the next clients 5v @ 1A hurrah! I can see them in the Boat/Motorhome/Cars on all TV's.

Again apologies for the rant.

Cheers
Spart