I found it HDR completely unusable in the first release, havent bothered since, no idea why they didnt include passthrough mode,... Doh!...
I think 90% of DSPlayer users only use it because it offers HDR in Windows. Many participants in this forum thread are power users who care about finetuning upscaling et cetera, but for most regular users, the default Kodi video is good enough - except for the fact that it won't do HDR in Windows.
That's also the case for me. I downloaded acquired several HDR10 mkv files that won't run properly in Kodi 17 or 18 because it won't do HDR passthrough. DSPlayer does this splendidly.
(Since I can't rip my 4K Blurays anyway, I'm slowly moving away from Kodi, and I've been using my dedicated 4K Bluray player more and more. I'm unhappy about it, but at least it works.)
Unfortunately, no HDR in Kodi means that Windows users can't really use full Netflix capabililty that Kodi 18 has, since that's probably the best legal HDR video source at the moment. And I think that's really against the team's ambition to disconnect the Kodi image from illegal downloads and streams. Maybe in the next version. I love Kodi and legal use of the latest tech would be awesome. But please don't read this as complaining or demanding, because I'm pretty happy with Kodi in general, and I know it's a lot of hard, unpaid work for the devs. It's just a bit of daydreaming.
Does anyone know whether the Kodi team intend to implement HDR passthrough for Windows in v19?
(2019-03-12, 16:42)willemd Wrote: [ -> ]Does anyone know whether the Kodi team intend to implement HDR passthrough for Windows in v19?
Yeah, this is why I was asking. I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that HDR passthrough wasn't supported, I was hopeful to be missing something. Unfortunately the
RERO approach doesn't seem to be working for devs (no criticism here, simple observation, I'm sure there's plenty of valid reasons), as such I'm afraid we'll be stuck with suboptimal HDR for a long time.
(2019-03-12, 16:42)willemd Wrote: [ -> ]I think 90% of DSPlayer users only use it because it offers HDR in Windows.
Sorry, I have to disagree there I'm afraid. By virtue, I believe those attracted to Dsplayer with MadVr are looking for the best Picture quality, whilst retaining the usability of Kodi, which it does, hands down.
I think the shame is people are missing out on so much with Dsplayer and madVR for HDR and everything else it offers. The hard part is for anyone not used to either, it does look quite complicated to set it all up.
A perfect world would be a 1 install setup with limited options unless you selected expert, maybe even a dial in your graphics card option and what media you have.
(2019-03-12, 20:09)ashlar Wrote: [ -> ] (2019-03-12, 16:42)willemd Wrote: [ -> ]Does anyone know whether the Kodi team intend to implement HDR passthrough for Windows in v19?
Yeah, this is why I was asking. I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that HDR passthrough wasn't supported, I was hopeful to be missing something. Unfortunately the RERO approach doesn't seem to be working for devs (no criticism here, simple observation, I'm sure there's plenty of valid reasons), as such I'm afraid we'll be stuck with suboptimal HDR for a long time.
There is no suitable Windows API available, only a manual HDR toggle switch. So only this toggle switch could be utilized. madVR is using the Nvidia and AMD video drivers to passthrough the HDR metadata.
I think I read a few times that the Windows version has to be dumbed down as everything is about cross platform, so I think anything dependent on Windows will be a very low priority.
I think it is more about the user experience. You would have to open and close Kodi to switch between HDR and SDR. It could be easier to simply use a desktop media player.
i wonder if there is a half way project that would be easier for someone. The current version of DS is heavily baked in with access to settings etc which dont really need to be there are you can set all these in the MADVR app, all we really need is a renderer switch so we could choose KODI renderer or MADVR very much like MPC-BE/HC etc.
This should be easier for someone to do, it might even be easier to do this from scratch rather than work from the current DS code as it would really just be a baked in external player.
Here's a thing with this idea too, you say KODI devs cant be convinced to take on MADVR and bake it in, I agree that will never happen, however them may be able to be convinced to open up rendering so alternative renderers can be chosen like other desktop video players.
This is the answer i had when i made a similar request in the Feature Requests section:
https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=335218
However, nobody else has requested or asked for the same issue, even if this particular DSplayer thread has so many people watching it....
(2019-03-13, 16:27)mclingo Wrote: [ -> ]i wonder if there is a half way project that would be easier for someone. The current version of DS is heavily baked in with access to settings etc which dont really need to be there are you can set all these in the MADVR app, all we really need is a renderer switch so we could choose KODI renderer or MADVR very much like MPC-BE/HC etc.
This should be easier for someone to do, it might even be easier to do this from scratch rather than work from the current DS code as it would really just be a baked in external player.
Here's a thing with this idea too, you say KODI devs cant be convinced to take on MADVR and bake it in, I agree that will never happen, however them may be able to be convinced to open up rendering so alternative renderers can be chosen like other desktop video players.
I think what would need to be ported to Kodi 18 is the section on media filters/rules and the video renderer itself. "That's it". All the portion on settings to specific filters configuration, madVR configuration, etc. could be done without. I understand why aracnoz chose to implement it but, at the end of the day, it's a "nice to have" not something mandatory.
I've asked, repeatedly, if something like this could be done as a binary addon. After all... Kodi now "supports" DRM based services, such as Amazon and Netflix. I guess there could/should be a way of achieving the above for an update to DSPlayer.
(2019-03-13, 16:37)vitocorl Wrote: [ -> ]This is the answer i had when i made a similar request in the Feature Requests section: https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=335218
However, nobody else has requested or asked for the same issue, even if this particular DSplayer thread has so many people watching it....
madVR is based on DirectShow and Kodi isn't, so there is a complete mismatch in decoding and rendering. For HDR, in particular, it is becoming imperative to use LAV Filters for all playback. There is even some early support in LAV Filters for at least recognizing HDR10+ and HLG, and supposedly the Nvidia video drivers may have some test code support for Dolby Vision (How that might work seems up in the air in terms of the new methods that may be on the horizon to rip and play Dolby Vision content). LAV Filters alone would not be compatible with Kodi VideoPlayer.
I don't see any need to bash VideoPlayer. It is what it is and a good media player, not a poor one. The best you can do is request "realistic" features that could be added at some point in the future.
(2019-03-13, 16:27)mclingo Wrote: [ -> ]i wonder if there is a half way project that would be easier for someone. The current version of DS is heavily baked in with access to settings etc which dont really need to be there are you can set all these in the MADVR app, all we really need is a renderer switch so we could choose KODI renderer or MADVR very much like MPC-BE/HC etc.
This should be easier for someone to do, it might even be easier to do this from scratch rather than work from the current DS code as it would really just be a baked in external player.
Here's a thing with this idea too, you say KODI devs cant be convinced to take on MADVR and bake it in, I agree that will never happen, however them may be able to be convinced to open up rendering so alternative renderers can be chosen like other desktop video players.
The settings in the video menu accessed during video playback are actually a separate add-on and a limited burden on programming. The save in DSPlayer database feature and the few madVR settings in the DSPlayer settings menu could certainly be eliminated. However, that doesn't lose much weight, and wouldn't be a good reason to start over when the technical challenges of adding madVR support to Kodi have already been overcome in the current DSPlayer. DSPlayer would have to go on in its current form and maybe lose some unneeded code to keep it more lightweight.
The videoplayer itself (subtitle support, audio support, playback engine, OSD etc.) are where the bulk of the code would be found and this can't simply be replaced by VideoPlayer because they are completely different playback engines.
People are throwing around reasons for using DSPlayer, and I'll give it to you. It has nothing to do with HDR for most people. Kodi's built in player is slow and not very good at a lot of things. This is not intended to be offensive. They are aware of it, and they are clearly trying to improve it bit by bit.
I use DSPlayer because it can render subtitles without completely shutting Kodi down with lag. This is one reason to use it. Another reason is scaling algorithms. There's frame interpolation, HDR (which is poorly implemented at best, due to lack of OS and driver support), 3D (without killing kodi with lag again...), better sound support, and many more reasons.
Don't act like your specific use case speaks for even a majority of users.
Addon developers can make things work with DSPlayer if they want to, as well. I did. It's comparatively easy, considering that DSPlayer is entirely C++ on top of decades old code originally written for XBOX.
Someone wanted some ideas of what is required or helpful. Here's some that I encountered when attempting to aid development myself:
- C++ and all of the build tools involved
- Thorough knowledge of DirectX/DirectDraw/OpenGL/Windows Graphics and Sound APIs. This isn't completely necessary to work on DSPlayer, but you'll hit weird issues with no clue how to approach them without experience in those.
- Thorough knowledge of media codecs, how to parse them (even with libraries), and how to forward them to another application
- The ability to write code that does not crash. This does not mean that errors can't occur, but that you are capable of thinking and writing in a way that includes failsafe fallbacks to everything you do. You should never hit play or stop, and then see Kodi indefinitely lock up or crash.
- Knowledge of memory management in C++, specifically involving reading, managing, and closing streams.
- File Locking, as nothing will work if you are not letting MadVR, LAV, etc even access the filestream that you hand it.
- DRM and copyright implications, mainly to cover your own ass and prevent an accidental legal issue.
- Concepts on video technologies involved with encoding, including how framerate, codecs, containers, 3D and HDR, and things of that nature may screw with things. Not knowing these will cause poor color quality or worse.
- THE ABILITY TO BE POLITE, RESPECTFUL, AND INTERACT WITH A TOXIC COMMUNITY. If this thread shows anything, it's that no matter how cool you are, there are people who don't deserve your time. Despite that, you still can't be blatantly rude, or the experience will be ruined for all, and it'll very quickly drive you away when you realize nothing is worse than working for free and getting involved in petty flame wars over it.
Most of these do not require Book of Magnus level knowledge, but if you don't at least understand what they are and how they work, you will drop the project when you encounter an issue that flies a mile over your head.
(2019-03-14, 21:30)da3dsoul Wrote: [ -> ]People are throwing around reasons for using DSPlayer, and I'll give it to you.
What a strange passive aggressive post that was, what is your point again ?