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--- Thread: Vero OSMC (/showthread.php?tid=209785)

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RE: Vero OSMC - fritsch - 2015-05-29

Sorry, that someone tells his oppinion in a public, non censored forum.

The vero is double the price of a black i2 box with similar remote + cable.
It has design flaws, where IR gets worse, when the front LED is on. User need to remove the plastic in front of IR to get better reception.
SPDIF cables don't fit in the spdif slot.
imx6 in general cannot play blurays in their native refreshrate, which causes dts-hd, truehd to skip and drop every ~ 10 to 12 seconds - with luck every 40 seconds. <- HW limitation
imx6 (especially GC880) is too slow to play 1080i50 h264 livetv, cause of the bus limitations GC880 has. <- HW limitation
Hardware has issues with certain switches, so that lan needs to be throttled (RPi2 and such works on same switch)

Features announced but not there:
- 3D (like the Pi does)

^^ What is wrong stating these facts in this forum?

So @swetoast: Why is it not allowed to state these facts?


RE: Vero OSMC - Koying - 2015-05-29

How is the GPL relevant? This is a place to discuss the merit of Kodi hardware.
Besides the imx6 inherent flaws, obviously price matter.

It's actually fanboys who are rotting this thread...


RE: Vero OSMC - swetoast - 2015-05-29

Its been stated over and over and over for 29 pages think its pretty fucking obvious what you and the rest feel so give it a rest now... and let the users talk about what they actually think or do you wanna go for another 29 pages

again the GPL violators on this forum gets a better treatment but they are gold sponsors so my question is if Sam was to become a sponsor would he get better treatment ?

that seems like a fun sensitive question to ask..

that old say money talks and bullshit walks seems to have a nice ring to it Big Grin


RE: Vero OSMC - Koying - 2015-05-29

Well continue to reiterate as long as people like you tries to prevent it Wink
Wrxtasy was asking a generic imx6 question and you brought it back to a Vero-specific issue...


RE: Vero OSMC - Koying - 2015-05-29

BTW, the Vero guys should really stop jumping in and trying to suppress any negative opinion on their preferred device, be it here or the OSMC forum.

This a display of weakness...


RE: Vero OSMC - fritsch - 2015-05-29

(2015-05-29, 08:02)fritsch Wrote: Sorry, that someone tells his oppinion in a public, non censored forum.

The vero is double the price of a black i2 box with similar remote + cable.
It has design flaws, where IR gets worse, when the front LED is on. User need to remove the plastic in front of IR to get better reception.
SPDIF cables don't fit in the spdif slot.
imx6 in general cannot play blurays in their native refreshrate, which causes dts-hd, truehd to skip and drop every ~ 10 to 12 seconds - with luck every 40 seconds. <- HW limitation
imx6 (especially GC880) is too slow to play 1080i50 h264 livetv, cause of the bus limitations GC880 has. <- HW limitation
Hardware has issues with certain switches, so that lan needs to be throttled (RPi2 and such works on same switch)

Features announced but not there:
- 3D (like the Pi does)

^^ What is wrong stating these facts in this forum?

So @swetoast: Why is it not allowed to state these facts?

Summary for the enduser:

If you don't need (hd) audio passthrough and only watch 1080p bluray rips with <= 30 fps, don't use livetv, don't have a dashcam (1080p60), you like to switch 3D modes manually with your TV's remote and if you want to support osmc project and their makers financially, then this is your offer of choice.


RE: Vero OSMC - Karnagious - 2015-05-29

(2015-05-29, 08:24)Koying Wrote: BTW, the Vero guys should really stop jumping in and trying to suppress any negative opinion on their preferred device, be it here or the OSMC forum.

This a display of weakness...

There is one Vero guy.

And if you want to talk about displays of weakness, lets discuss strawmen.


RE: Vero OSMC - fritsch - 2015-05-29

(2015-05-29, 08:34)fritsch Wrote:
(2015-05-29, 08:02)fritsch Wrote: Sorry, that someone tells his oppinion in a public, non censored forum.

The vero is double the price of a black i2 box with similar remote + cable.
It has design flaws, where IR gets worse, when the front LED is on. User need to remove the plastic in front of IR to get better reception.
SPDIF cables don't fit in the spdif slot.
imx6 in general cannot play blurays in their native refreshrate, which causes dts-hd, truehd to skip and drop every ~ 10 to 12 seconds - with luck every 40 seconds. <- HW limitation
imx6 (especially GC880) is too slow to play 1080i50 h264 livetv, cause of the bus limitations GC880 has. <- HW limitation
Hardware has issues with certain switches, so that lan needs to be throttled (RPi2 and such works on same switch)

Features announced but not there:
- 3D (like the Pi does)

^^ What is wrong stating these facts in this forum?

So @swetoast: Why is it not allowed to state these facts?

Summary for the enduser:

If you don't need (hd) audio passthrough and only watch 1080p bluray rips with <= 30 fps, don't use livetv, don't have a dashcam (1080p60), you like to switch 3D modes manually with your TV's remote and if you want to support osmc project and their makers financially, then this is your offer of choice.

Another bump. So that users don't need to read through 29 pages and find the summary right at the end.


RE: Vero OSMC - Koying - 2015-05-29

Oh, and +1 To what Ned said.
Unless you want spdif (with a knife Wink), the imx6 platform for Kodi basically became irrelevant the moment the rpi2 appeared.

I'm 100% sure Sam wouldn't have gone with this platform would he have known about it earlier...


RE: Vero OSMC - nickr - 2015-05-29

IMHO:

1. Sam is brave for trying to make a business out of this. I think 3 years support and a 'plug & play' system is a viable business model, far better than the asses selling 'fully loaded' android crap. Good for him.

2. He got the hardware wrong, but that is easy to say in retrospect.

3. Can we stop the negativity? There is enough info now for people to know it isn't an ideal hardware platform, but they might benefit from the support contract. That about summarises it.


RE: Vero OSMC - Koying - 2015-05-29

(2015-05-29, 10:15)nickr Wrote: 3. Can we stop the negativity? There is enough info now for people to know it isn't an ideal hardware platform, but they might benefit from the support contract. That about summarises it.

Indeed. I think everything that had to be said about the Vero has been.
@ned I suggest to close the thread to avoid any further bickering, but up to you.


RE: Vero OSMC - swetoast - 2015-05-29

Ohh so now reason has prevailed geez said that like 3 pages ago to close or spit the shit but then i was ambushed


RE: Vero OSMC - fritsch - 2015-05-29

Might have to do with your wording and the argument free ranting?


RE: Vero OSMC - DBMandrake - 2015-05-29

(2015-05-29, 08:02)fritsch Wrote: Hardware has issues with certain switches, so that lan needs to be throttled (RPi2 and such works on same switch)

^^ What is wrong stating these facts in this forum?
Sorry but this is very misleading to the point of not being true, so needs correcting. Wink

RPi2 works fine on the same switch because it is only a 100Mbit Ethernet controller! Set the Vero interface to 100Mbit and it too will work fine on the same switch with broken flow control.

The RPi2 has a 100Mbit Ethernet controller attached to a 480Mbps USB2.0 hub, so it is impossible for the Ethernet controller to saturate the USB bus, so flow control is not required. The Vero has a Gigabit Ethernet controller attached to a 480Mbps USB2.0 hub so under the right conditions in Gigabit mode it is possible to saturate the USB bus and case receive overflows. Ethernet flow control solves the issue completely and is a standard feature on nearly all switches (including consumer grade) but there are a small number of switches that either don't have it or where it is broken or turned off.

The only time I have been able to reproduce the receive overflow issue was by deliberately turning off flow control on an enterprise switch. (Most consumer switches don't let you turn it off)

With a standard flow control enabled consumer grade cable modem/switch (my home cable router) I have measured iperf receive throughput of 466Mbps and send throughput of 350Mbps, with no packet loss. 466Mbps is very close to the theoretical maximum throughput of the USB bus.

While we're talking about problems, lets not forget the severe USB performance problems that plagued the Raspberry Pi for a long long time - as recently as late last year simply copying a file across the network using the built in Ethernet controller would cause a USB connected keyboard to suffer from missed keystrokes or "stuck down" key repeats because of lost USB packets. I personally experienced as many as 5 lost key strokes per 10 seconds, and a stuck down repeating key when typing at least every 30 seconds. It was so bad that I did not even attempt to type at the local console while heavy network activity was occurring.

The initial workaround for this was to drop to USB 1.1 mode, (great...) later on the USB driver was rewritten a couple of times to try to work around hardware deficiencies in the USB controller in the Pi. Although I have not tested it recently last time I checked this problem it was much improved but was not 100% solved and may never be, due to hardware limitations. I have never seen any problems with lost USB packets (USB keyboard lost keystrokes etc) on the Vero during high network activity.

Just so we don't give the impression here that the Raspberry Pi is without its own problems. Wink


RE: Vero OSMC - fritsch - 2015-05-29

Thanks for this correction.

Concerning, this statement:

Quote:The initial workaround for this was to drop to USB 1.1 mode, (great...) later on the USB driver was rewritten a couple of times to try to work around hardware deficiencies in the USB controller in the Pi. Although I have not tested it recently last time I checked this problem was not 100% solved and may never be, due to hardware limitations. I have never seen any problems with lost USB packets (USB keyboard lost keystrokes etc) on the Vero during high network activity.

You can make an easy test. Scrape your videos from scratch, or write something onto the sdcard. While doing so try to watch 1080i50 content. You will see blackouts of the screen, which happens when there is huge load on network in combination with busload of gpu decoding.

Others also have reported freezes and hangs while fast forwarding, when using 1Gbit vero. Throtteling to 100Mbit/s solves their issue.