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+---- Thread: XBMC Linux port questions and answers... (/showthread.php?tid=26097)
- Livin - 2007-05-29
Gamester/ultrabrutal,
Sorry for misunderstanding the point of the post.
But I do maintain that keep the platform open is better for the community... though I do understand what limiting the hw does for dev & troubleshooting I also realize what limitations you encounter... just ask JM and the other devs what they've had to work-around to get things working and what items they'd like to do, but cannot. I'm sure the list is fairly large.
I can understand limiting the general hardware but not to 1 or 2 specific closed platforms... that is not the best way to promote XBMC or allow it to grow but allowing other devs in that may not want a PS3, X360, or ATv, etc.
With the unified driver sets that ATI & NVidia use keeping to the two largest vendors for video makes sense... and even saying something like DX10 or DX9 or OpenGL is a must. I understand perfectly.
Requiring a specific 'closed' platform... not the best option IMO.
- Gamester17 - 2007-05-29
Affini Wrote:I can understand limiting the general hardware but not to 1 or 2 specific closed platforms... that is not the best way to promote XBMC or allow it to grow but allowing other devs in that may not want a PS3, X360, or ATv, etc.Again you have not read the whole post or missunderstod it. Developers and end-users will not be limited to those fixed hardware platforms, developers and end-users alike will at least be able to run it on any x86-based hardware platform they like. The only thing that we will be limiting is the end-user support from Team-XBMC and these forums, if you as an end-users do not run on a supported hardware platform then we will not help you, period, simple as that. You may still run XBMC, and it may or may not run as well on a supported hardware platform but if you run into problem or discover a bug then you will not get any assistance from Team-XBMC or in this forum, nor will we be accepting any bug-reports unless the end-user can replicate the problem on a supported hardware platform. ...developers are the only ones we will assist if they run a other hardware platform, but only if the thing they want help with is not directly related to their unsupported hardware platform.
- seaweed - 2007-05-29
The Aopen Santa Rosa-based miniPC Duo MP965-VDR looks realy promising, it will have both component and hdmi output, and uses ntel's 965GM chipset with intel Clear Video Technology.
Lets just hope the price wont be to scary
- pike - 2007-05-29
I just wish Intel who made great progress with their opensource drivers, would also include Intel Clear Video / Viiv and such stuff in their OSS efforts
- Gamester17 - 2007-05-29
Yes, Intel and VIA and the only manufacturers who provide proper open source device drivers. VIA got 1up on Intel as they also provide code for their video hardware acceleration API via XvMC, but we/you can always all do our best to lobby Intel to do the same:
http://intellinuxgraphics.org
http://openchrome.org
Nevertheless, even if discussing hardware is fun in itself, it is really a moot point until the Linux port of XBMC get relativly up-to-date and stable for end-users to start using, ...which ETA is probebely too hard to estimate today as so many factors are involved (summer holidays coming up, more developers might join in the effort and/or existing developers might drop the project, etc.), however my personal guess it that is at least 3 to 6 months away before be can think about locked down any hardware limitations, (disclaimer: this is only my personal opinions and guess, note that I am not a programmer/developer, I could not even code to save my life)
- pike - 2007-05-29
http://digg.com/linux_unix/XBMC_recruiting_developers_for_Linux_port
- Gamester17 - 2007-05-29
"HELP-WANTED" 'add' posted on www.xboxmediacenter.com - everyone please spead the news!
- jonb2 - 2007-05-29
Forget mac, it makes no sense what-so-ever to port linux and yet pick mac hardware as the supported system. Yes I am aware of mac-tels that can run linux and windows, but it's a still a mac and only 3% of computer users use any type of mac.
If you want to standardize and port to linux a much better way to do it would be to look at the packages in linux that you will be using and find out what specific hardware is the easiest to code for, best supported, and largest user base. Then pick the 2 video cards 2 sound cards two chipsets etc...
In other words one system amd the other is intel, one is ati the other nvidia, one is realtek the other is soundblaster (though sound blaster might not make the cut in the easy to code for dept). This gives you much broader coverage and you have hardware that everyone else has and a straight forward upgrade path. Instead of some oddball mac that only sells 100000 units during it's entire life cycle, and is incompatible or possibly discontinued at next-gen.
The other option, but I don't this one is as good because the user base is a different animal, would be to pick a low-end dell/hp and high-end dell/hp. There are the top 2 manufactures, however most of their users are not running linux or XBMC. So while they comprise more then 30% of the entire pc market they probably only comprise about 1% of the future XBMC user base.
- skruven - 2007-05-29
jonb2 Wrote:Forget mac, it makes no sense what-so-ever to port linux and yet pick mac hardware as the supported system. Yes I am aware of mac-tels that can run linux and windows, but it's a still a mac and only 3% of computer users use any type of mac.
I think that the aTV would be a great platform. Its the design and the features that i want. Hell it dosent even run OSX!
Thats why i think many people wants the aTV as a platform. The uniqe design and kinda good features.
The macmini is another good platform. Coz of the design and the hardware features in the slim box. If you come up with anoter cool and neat pre-build box in that size, I would take a look on it and speak again
- ultrabrutal - 2007-05-29
jonb2, you're missing the point. the point is not having to rely on pc hardware or dell/hp machine which usually is gone after 3 months (replaced by new series). then we would have to support new hardware and the old is obsolete. the point is to find some hardware which survives over many years - just like the Xbox does/did. xbox360, ps3, macmini and appletv are such hardware. if you can come up with something else, let us hear
- jonb2 - 2007-05-29
No your missing the point. The same linux that ran on a 386 back in 1995 will run on a brand new just built last week from not yet released reference design new hardware pc. You don't pick a niche product to be the only hardware you support you pick the most common.
XBMC on linux is not relying on hardware, it is relying on linux. They are not creating an operating system they are creating an application, and application that needs certain video and audio requirements. So you choose the hardware that is most popular and least problematic.
- ultrabrutal - 2007-05-29
jonb2, most common meaning any pc hardware in your case. show me one motherboard and graphicscard from today that you can buy in 5 years. heck even in 6 months. xbmc will not be limited - it's opensource. you can run it on your 1995 pc for all I care.
xbmc rely on linux and linux rely on hardware - hence xbmc rely on hardware too. say you are having trouble with your xbmc pc because you are using some odd graphicscard. where will you seek help? nowhere! you have to figure it all out on yourself. most people are end users who just want it to work stable and as intendeed. you will not get this with your bamboo pc.
- mace - 2007-05-29
The only way to get HW stability with major vendors like HP and Dell is to buy their corp modells. One of the reasons for their higher pricetags is the longer lifespan of those modells.
And stability is the holy grail. It doesn't matter how fast it runs, on wich HW or what features it has if it isn't rock stable. In my opinion it has to be as stable as a vcr or a dvd recorder. In other words better than most current set top boxes.
That in turn requiers a fairly small amount of HW support in order to keep testing at a reasonable level because you can't just say that one graphics adapter works. You have to say that this adapter works with this mainboard with this bios rev.
- raid517 - 2007-05-29
Sorry for the comment abuse. But may I just bow and scrape in both utter grattitude and worship for those who have taken this bold decision?
I have wanted this to happen ever since XBMC was first released - and have begged and pleaded for it on many, many occasions.
You guys rock - and XBMC rocks like no other Media Center app. on the planet and now (or in the near future perhaps) I can fulfil my dream of building a small dedicated XBMC machine and of finally retiring my almost antique and venerable old XBox1.
It also resolves another dilemma in my mind - which is the requirement to compile XBMC (an open source and wholly honest application) using an illegal (and in most cases stolen) SDK. (An SDK that is also almost undoubtedly becoming rapidly out of date, particularly in light of the ever increasing demands of HDTV and new media types, both current and those yet to be envisaged).
But now XBMC has a future - and it deserves a future. It does not deserve to die as the XBox1 user base continues on it's ever more rapid decline.
So I take my hat off to you guys and I say thanks. Thanks for all the years that have passed - and thanks once more for hopefully all of the years to come.
Some things make life that little more bearable and that little bit more enjoyable - and in my view XBMC is certainly up there among the best of these.
- BLKMGK - 2007-05-30
I too have been awaiting news like this and just spotted the recruitment announcement, this is wonderful! I've read with interest the comments on hardware support. One of the things I've moaned for with Myth has been for those guys to pick a solid danged HW platform and support the heck out of it the way XBMC has been supported on XBOX hardware. I think that limiting support to a specific couple of platforms is a great way to go.
The aTV is an excellent CHEAP platform if it's powerful enough, the Mini or the upcoming Mini also good, the 360 would be nice but umm yeah okay maybe someday. Pick a solid patform for this, I'll buy it - simple as that. I have multiple XBOX1 (give them as gifts with XBMC on it), and two 360s - one with old firmware. If you pick the aTV I'll own one or more of those too
The solid support is worth it for both end user and developers IMO. The idea that you somehow support 360 peripherals is also pretty awesome, if it's successful that will be terrific. I wouldn't necessarily be looking to choose a platform someone is going to have in their closet but something that works and isn't too tough on the developers. The Apple hardware, and I own none of it, looks pretty good thus far....Good Luck guys, I for one am certainly rooting for you and when things are far enough along will happily purchase hardware and help test!