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START HERE - Pick the Right Kodi Box (updated June 2020)
(2018-12-08, 16:26)noggin Wrote:
(2018-12-08, 16:11)clarkss12 Wrote: Where do people get there 4k videos, in a **mobile** formatHuh  I was able to acquire an HEVC encoded movie a couple of weeks ago, through a not so reputable source to do some testing, will delete it when I get done testing.

From my results, only my Nvidia Shield and Zidoo X9S, and some of my **cheap Chinese** boxes running LibreELEC or CoreELEC could play that video.  Even my moderately powered Windows 10, desktop computer could not play that movie.  I do not have a 4k firestick to test.

To be noted, I have tested numerous 4k clips, and most of those clips play on most of my devices, but this REAL movie will NOT play on those devices.

Information from the Mediainfo Windows app.

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : HEVC
Format/Info                              : High Efficiency Video Coding
Commercial name                          : HDR10
Format profile                           : Main [email protected]@high
Codec ID                                 : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration                                 : 1 h 42 min
Bit rate                                 : 69.1 Mb/s
Width                                    : 3 840 pixels
Height                                   : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth                                : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.348
Stream size                              : 49.5 GiB (95%)
 A lot of early 4K content was 4K h.264 8-bit and 4K h.264 8-bit content will play on Intels from around Haswell onwards, as these devices had h.264 hardware acceleration that was good enough to play this.

However - real world UHD Blu-ray movies (which can now be ripped) are in 10-bit HEVC/h.265 and usually also in HDR10 format.  This is much more demanding to play - so needs a more recent playback solution - and you also have to factor in the complication of HDR output or HDR->SDR conversion. You will also see that UHD Blu-ray lossless rips can often have very high bitrates - which will also stress network connectivity if you are streaming them from a NAS or similar.

What do you mean by **mobile** format?  A format for playing on mobile phones - or something with smaller file sizes and lower bit rate (and thus lower quality)?  
 I did not know what word to use instead of **mobile**.  I mean a ripped copy of a 4k movie that can be used with a storage device and not a Blue-Ray player.  I am really behind the media cure.  I am still slowly converting my DVD rips to BlueRay rips.  I just purchased the ** Back to the Future ** series on Blue-Ray and ripped them.  I am trying different methods to convert those rips to .h264 or HEVC, natively, they are encoded with VC-1.

Video
ID                                       : 1
ID in the original source medium         : 4113 (0x1011)
Format                                   : VC-1
Format profile                           : [email protected]
Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / WVC1
Codec ID/Hint                            : Microsoft
Duration                                 : 1 h 56 min
Bit rate                                 : 26.9 Mb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.541
Stream size                              : 21.8 GiB (81%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray
Reply
thanks for reply noggin, ill probally order vero 4k+ later then unless you or anyone has better suggestion. thanks
NUC5I5RYH
yamaha RX-V777
BenQ w1070
samsung ue55nu7100

Reply
(2018-12-08, 17:26)clarkss12 Wrote:
(2018-12-08, 16:26)noggin Wrote:
(2018-12-08, 16:11)clarkss12 Wrote: Where do people get there 4k videos, in a **mobile** formatHuh  I was able to acquire an HEVC encoded movie a couple of weeks ago, through a not so reputable source to do some testing, will delete it when I get done testing.

From my results, only my Nvidia Shield and Zidoo X9S, and some of my **cheap Chinese** boxes running LibreELEC or CoreELEC could play that video.  Even my moderately powered Windows 10, desktop computer could not play that movie.  I do not have a 4k firestick to test.

To be noted, I have tested numerous 4k clips, and most of those clips play on most of my devices, but this REAL movie will NOT play on those devices.

Information from the Mediainfo Windows app.

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : HEVC
Format/Info                              : High Efficiency Video Coding
Commercial name                          : HDR10
Format profile                           : Main [email protected]@high
Codec ID                                 : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration                                 : 1 h 42 min
Bit rate                                 : 69.1 Mb/s
Width                                    : 3 840 pixels
Height                                   : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth                                : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.348
Stream size                              : 49.5 GiB (95%)
 A lot of early 4K content was 4K h.264 8-bit and 4K h.264 8-bit content will play on Intels from around Haswell onwards, as these devices had h.264 hardware acceleration that was good enough to play this.

However - real world UHD Blu-ray movies (which can now be ripped) are in 10-bit HEVC/h.265 and usually also in HDR10 format.  This is much more demanding to play - so needs a more recent playback solution - and you also have to factor in the complication of HDR output or HDR->SDR conversion. You will also see that UHD Blu-ray lossless rips can often have very high bitrates - which will also stress network connectivity if you are streaming them from a NAS or similar.

What do you mean by **mobile** format?  A format for playing on mobile phones - or something with smaller file sizes and lower bit rate (and thus lower quality)?     
 I did not know what word to use instead of **mobile**.  I mean a ripped copy of a 4k movie that can be used with a storage device and not a Blue-Ray player.  I am really behind the media cure.  I am still slowly converting my DVD rips to BlueRay rips.  I just purchased the ** Back to the Future ** series on Blue-Ray and ripped them.  I am trying different methods to convert those rips to .h264 or HEVC, natively, they are encoded with VC-1.

Video
ID                                       : 1
ID in the original source medium         : 4113 (0x1011)
Format                                   : VC-1
Format profile                           : [email protected]
Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / WVC1
Codec ID/Hint                            : Microsoft
Duration                                 : 1 h 56 min
Bit rate                                 : 26.9 Mb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.541
Stream size                              : 21.8 GiB (81%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray   
  
If you have the storage capacity - why not leave them as is? (That said some platforms have issues with high bitrate VC-1 content)

After ripping all my CDs to 192k MP3 back in the day, and then re-ripping them lossless a few years later, I'm now very much of the view that if at all possible it's a good idea to rip DVDs, Blu-rays and UHD Blu-rays losslessly. If there are extras you don't mind not having (and are happy to go back to the discs for) then just ripping the movie can save you a useful amount of space.

There are a number of modern, relatively low cost, Kodi platforms that can playback lossless UHD Blu-ray rips now (such as a number of AMLogic platforms, the nVidia Shield TV etc.)
Reply
(2018-12-08, 17:59)noggin Wrote:
(2018-12-08, 17:26)clarkss12 Wrote:
(2018-12-08, 16:26)noggin Wrote:  A lot of early 4K content was 4K h.264 8-bit and 4K h.264 8-bit content will play on Intels from around Haswell onwards, as these devices had h.264 hardware acceleration that was good enough to play this.

However - real world UHD Blu-ray movies (which can now be ripped) are in 10-bit HEVC/h.265 and usually also in HDR10 format.  This is much more demanding to play - so needs a more recent playback solution - and you also have to factor in the complication of HDR output or HDR->SDR conversion. You will also see that UHD Blu-ray lossless rips can often have very high bitrates - which will also stress network connectivity if you are streaming them from a NAS or similar.

What do you mean by **mobile** format?  A format for playing on mobile phones - or something with smaller file sizes and lower bit rate (and thus lower quality)?     
 I did not know what word to use instead of **mobile**.  I mean a ripped copy of a 4k movie that can be used with a storage device and not a Blue-Ray player.  I am really behind the media cure.  I am still slowly converting my DVD rips to BlueRay rips.  I just purchased the ** Back to the Future ** series on Blue-Ray and ripped them.  I am trying different methods to convert those rips to .h264 or HEVC, natively, they are encoded with VC-1.

Video
ID                                       : 1
ID in the original source medium         : 4113 (0x1011)
Format                                   : VC-1
Format profile                           : [email protected]
Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / WVC1
Codec ID/Hint                            : Microsoft
Duration                                 : 1 h 56 min
Bit rate                                 : 26.9 Mb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.541
Stream size                              : 21.8 GiB (81%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray     
  
If you have the storage capacity - why not leave them as is? (That said some platforms have issues with high bitrate VC-1 content)

After ripping all my CDs to 192k MP3 back in the day, and then re-ripping them lossless a few years later, I'm now very much of the view that if at all possible it's a good idea to rip DVDs, Blu-rays and UHD Blu-rays losslessly. If there are extras you don't mind not having (and are happy to go back to the discs for) then just ripping the movie can save you a useful amount of space.

There are a number of modern, relatively low cost, Kodi platforms that can playback lossless UHD Blu-ray rips now (such as a number of AMLogic platforms, the nVidia Shield TV etc.)  
You are probably correct about leaving the rips as they are, instead of trying to change the codec to something else.  I have been trying different converter apps and not very successful at it.  Right now, I am trying to convert that "Back to the Future" movie to an HEVC codec using Handbrake, but it takes over 9 hours.  I will see what the results look like.  If I screw up, I can always re-rip the movie. 

And yes, that VC-1 codec plays havoc with some (most) of my Android boxes.
Reply
clarkss12 dateline=' Wrote: And yes, that VC-1 codec plays havoc with some (most) of my Android boxes.

Have a read of THIS thread and you will understand why.

Reply
I've Spent a lot of time reading here and at the LibreElec forums and I need some help choosing a Box.
I've narrowed it down to the following (questions I have about them in the brackets)

My Must haves: Good Wifi (wired isn't an option, dual ac preferred.), Dual Boot (hopefully relatively easy once set up, cause my wife will be using as well while on mat leave so anything more than dual booting with the remote is too much) because..., 1080p Netflix (I don't mind using a tablet version of the app in android, we've been using one on a TX3 mini for months now) 
I'll be running LibreELEC but no crazy files or anything.

I've narrowed it down to the following list:
Mecool BB2 Pro - DDR4 Ram (is there a libreelec build for this? Can it get 1080p Netflix? Is the DDR4 worth it?)
Mecool M8S Pro L - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Mecool KI Pro - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Wetek Hub/Play2 (Go for the AC Hub? or the 2GB RAM Play2?)
Minix U1 (Can it get 1080P Netflix?)

All are about the same price (give or take $10, I'm in Canada). I'm leaning towards the KI Pro or the Play 2. Any suggestions? I officially hit analysis paralysis. Doesn't help that you guys have so much helpful information.  Tongue
If you could order the above from which one you would get firs to which one you would get last and why, I would be eternally grateful.  Tongue
Reply
I have Mecool M8S Pro L - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?) the wifi has packed up after a month. Netflix now doesn't work. Go to Freaktabs forum for info about this

not sure if posting this list is allowed, be here it is https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1...sp=sharing
Reply
(2018-12-11, 18:49)bankarsonist Wrote: My Must haves: Good Wifi (wired isn't an option, dual ac preferred.),
Dual Boot (hopefully relatively easy once set up, cause my wife will be using as well while on mat leave so anything more than dual booting with the remote is too much) because..
1080p Netflix (I don't mind using a tablet version of the app in android, we've been using one on a TX3 mini for months now) 
I'll be running LibreELEC but no crazy files or anything.

I've narrowed it down to the following list:
Mecool BB2 Pro - DDR4 Ram (is there a libreelec build for this? Can it get 1080p Netflix? Is the DDR4 worth it?)
Mecool M8S Pro L - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Mecool KI Pro - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Wetek Hub/Play2 (Go for the AC Hub? or the 2GB RAM Play2?)
Minix U1 (Can it get 1080P Netflix?)

All are about the same price (give or take $10, I'm in Canada). I'm leaning towards the KI Pro or the Play 2. Any suggestions? I officially hit analysis paralysis. Doesn't help that you guys have so much helpful information.  Tongue
If you could order the above from which one you would get firs to which one you would get last and why, I would be eternally grateful.  Tongue

1080p Netflix needs a device with Widevine L1 DRM and HDCP 1.x

The MINIX U1 does not have that, the others do.
The Android TV OS App of Netflix no longer works on uncertified Netflix devices which is all of the above devices on the list.
A modded tablet version of the touchscreen Netflix App still works.

The MINIX U1 / U9 products have the best AC WiFi vs all the other AMLogic devices simply because they have two Antennas for AC MIMO WiFi.
They also have the best Wireless air mouse keyboard remotes - the MINIX A2 lite is the best one to get.
They also have the best heatsinks of the entire AML family.

The WeTek Play2 has B/G/N WiFi only. Avoid the WeTek Hub for anything Android. 1GB RAM causes issues with Android, its fine with LibreELEC.
You will need a Wireless Air mouse remote to use the Netflix tablet App.

You can get 1080p Netflix using the Kodi Leia Netflix Addon (click) on Android device with Widevine L1 DRM. (reliability may be an issue)
You also get 5.1 DD+ or 5.1 DD audio from that Kodi Leia Netflix Addon as well.

Only the MINIX U9 and the Play2 have working Android Kodi Leia auto refresh switching for silky smooth 24p Android Kodi Leia Netflix playback.

What would I get for dual boot ?
A MINIX U9 simply because of superior hardware and the high quality integrated Wireless remote.
Otherwise the Mecool's that have Widevine L1 DRM, HDCP 1.x and AC WiFi, and add a Wireless Air Mouse remote to them.

Netflix and AC WiFi the main priority - seriously consider a 3rd option the 2018 Amazon FireTV 4K Stick that has superior AC MIMO WiFi plus a real easy to use, reliable 1080p 4K HDR Netflix App. The 4K Stick's Wireless remote is the best one in the business.
Then simply sideload Kodi Leia.

Reply
Hello,

First post on the forums. I have been reading a lot of reviews and forum posts but confused and lost! Would you please recommend me several alternatives for my needs:

Setup: source (searching) > denon s730h receiver (hdcp 2.2 and atmos capable) > 4k projector and 5.1.2 atmos speakers

What I need / am looking for:
a. Netflix 4k HDR + atmos + if possible auto frame rate switching.
b. Able to play 4k HDR + pass through atmos (lossless) via hard disk (file sizes will be big so NTFS is required) - planning to use Kodi.
c. Able to use/play IPTV.
d. ethernet connection.
e. cost: as low as possible

I thought of :
- Apple TV 4k and firestick tv 4k but they are lacking (b), 
- using my pc (ryzen 2200g) but AMD haven't released playready drivers for Raven Ridge APU's and I found investing in a RX550 or higher polaris cards or gtx 1050 cards to be expensive and they could very well be cumbersome (drivers, windows issues, etc.),
 - not sure about S905D or S912 based android boxes (I have a mecool ms8 pro+ and netflix is down once again - twice this year - due to licensing issues) but I am open for a reliable one.

So, can you please recommend something suitable for me or share your thoughts. 
Best,
Reply
Hi, Welcome to the forums Smile

4K HDR Netflix + lossy Atmos= FireTV Stick 4K + Ugreen USB3 > Gigabit Ethernet adapter hub/cable if needed or...
if you want that plus Frame Rate Matching for silky smooth 24p Netflix = Apple TV 4K

Some modern TV's even remove 24p judder....

Judder-Free 24p on TVs (click)

Plug N Play home Networked 4K HDR + lossless Atmos + NTFS = Vero 4K+ running OSMC Kodi
or buy a Ugreen USB3 > Gigabit adapter for your M8S Pro+ and then run either LibreELEC Krypton or CoreELEC Leia on it from a Samsung EVO microSDHC card.
The M8S Pro+ with LE/CE is more than capable of 4K HDR & Atmos Kodi, it can even dual boot.

Buy a MINIX A2 lite Wireless remote for LE/CE Kodi on the M8S Pro+ - it's mini keyboard comes in real handy for Kodi Keyboard shortcuts !

W.

Reply
(2018-12-12, 15:49)wrxtasy Wrote: Hi, Welcome to the forums Smile

4K HDR Netflix + lossy Atmos= FireTV Stick 4K + Ugreen USB3 > Gigabit Ethernet adapter hub/cable if needed or...
if you want that plus Frame Rate Matching for silky smooth 24p Netflix = Apple TV 4K

Some modern TV's even remove 24p judder....

Judder-Free 24p on TVs (click)

Plug N Play home Networked 4K HDR + lossless Atmos + NTFS = Vero 4K+ running OSMC Kodi
or buy a Ugreen USB3 > Gigabit adapter for your M8S Pro+ and then run either LibreELEC Krypton or CoreELEC Leia on it from a Samsung EVO microSDHC card.
The M8S Pro+ with LE/CE is more than capable of 4K HDR & Atmos Kodi, it can even dual boot.

Buy a MINIX A2 lite Wireless remote for LE/CE Kodi on the M8S Pro+ - it's mini keyboard comes in real handy for Kodi Keyboard shortcuts !

W.
 Hello and thank you! 

Since M8S pro+ has an ethernet connection would there be any addition using a gigabit adapter? I wasn't aware that it is capable of 4k HDR + atmos passthrough (I will have the projector next week, I will try)! Which one would you recommend LibreELEC Krypton or CoreELEC Leia?

And for the netflix, I read that apple tv 4k doesn't have 24.0000 fps support based on this thread (23.976 is OK): https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-networ...video.html

For the netflix, which will be used most of the time, I really liked the firetv stick 4k but it is not listed as atmos capable: https://help.netflix.com/en/node/64066

Interesting not to find an all-in-one solution....
Reply
(2018-12-12, 16:36)ooztuncer Wrote: Since M8S pro+ has an ethernet connection would there be any addition using a gigabit adapter?

If you want to home network stream high bitrate 4K HDR Rips you NEED Gigabit Ethernet or a direct USB Hard Drive connection.
100Mbit only Ethernet cannot handle peak 4K HDR bitrates reliably, especially with HD audio also included into the stream.

Quote:I wasn't aware that it is capable of 4k HDR + atmos passthrough (I will have the projector next week, I will try)! Which one would you recommend LibreELEC Krypton or CoreELEC Leia?

Take your pick if you need Kodi Krypton or Leia.

Quote:And for the netflix, I read that apple tv 4k doesn't have 24.0000 fps support based on this thread (23.976 is OK): https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-networ...video.html

Really did not notice an issue when watching Netflix content to be honest inc. the Dark series.
I watch a Lot of Neflix on the ATV 4K.
As I said some TV's can remove 3:2 pulldown judder for 24p content output at 60Hz.

Quote:For the netflix, which will be used most of the time, I really liked the firetv stick 4k but it is not listed as atmos capable: https://help.netflix.com/en/node/64066
Interesting not to find an all-in-one solution....

Yes you are correct it's Prime Video that has Atmos support. I should have re-read my own Fire TV 4K stick post.

Reply
(2018-12-12, 03:50)wrxtasy Wrote:
(2018-12-11, 18:49)bankarsonist Wrote: My Must haves: Good Wifi (wired isn't an option, dual ac preferred.),
Dual Boot (hopefully relatively easy once set up, cause my wife will be using as well while on mat leave so anything more than dual booting with the remote is too much) because..
1080p Netflix (I don't mind using a tablet version of the app in android, we've been using one on a TX3 mini for months now) 
I'll be running LibreELEC but no crazy files or anything.

I've narrowed it down to the following list:
Mecool BB2 Pro - DDR4 Ram (is there a libreelec build for this? Can it get 1080p Netflix? Is the DDR4 worth it?)
Mecool M8S Pro L - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Mecool KI Pro - (AC wifi? Can it get 1080p Netflix?)
Wetek Hub/Play2 (Go for the AC Hub? or the 2GB RAM Play2?)
Minix U1 (Can it get 1080P Netflix?)

All are about the same price (give or take $10, I'm in Canada). I'm leaning towards the KI Pro or the Play 2. Any suggestions? I officially hit analysis paralysis. Doesn't help that you guys have so much helpful information.  Tongue
If you could order the above from which one you would get firs to which one you would get last and why, I would be eternally grateful.  Tongue

1080p Netflix needs a device with Widevine L1 DRM and HDCP 1.x

The MINIX U1 does not have that, the others do.
The Android TV OS App of Netflix no longer works on uncertified Netflix devices which is all of the above devices on the list.
A modded tablet version of the touchscreen Netflix App still works.

The MINIX U1 / U9 products have the best AC WiFi vs all the other AMLogic devices simply because they have two Antennas for AC MIMO WiFi.
They also have the best Wireless air mouse keyboard remotes - the MINIX A2 lite is the best one to get.
They also have the best heatsinks of the entire AML family.

The WeTek Play2 has B/G/N WiFi only. Avoid the WeTek Hub for anything Android. 1GB RAM causes issues with Android, its fine with LibreELEC.
You will need a Wireless Air mouse remote to use the Netflix tablet App.

You can get 1080p Netflix using the Kodi Leia Netflix Addon (click) on Android device with Widevine L1 DRM. (reliability may be an issue)
You also get 5.1 DD+ or 5.1 DD audio from that Kodi Leia Netflix Addon as well.

Only the MINIX U9 and the Play2 have working Android Kodi Leia auto refresh switching for silky smooth 24p Android Kodi Leia Netflix playback.

What would I get for dual boot ?
A MINIX U9 simply because of superior hardware and the high quality integrated Wireless remote.
Otherwise the Mecool's that have Widevine L1 DRM, HDCP 1.x and AC WiFi, and add a Wireless Air Mouse remote to them.

Netflix and AC WiFi the main priority - seriously consider a 3rd option the 2018 Amazon FireTV 4K Stick that has superior AC MIMO WiFi plus a real easy to use, reliable 1080p 4K HDR Netflix App. The 4K Stick's Wireless remote is the best one in the business.
Then simply sideload Kodi Leia. 
I just wanted to say thank you! This is exactly what I needed. The U9 is close to $100 more so I think I will go Mecool. Now just to figure out which one.  Confused Appreciate the help!
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Netflix is not working on the Mecool M8S Pro L  from the below post, it seems Netflix are blocking non certified boxes

https://forum.freaktab.com/forum/tv-play...xes/page30
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What cpu should i looking if i want 4k hdr/1080p sw decoded for netflix/amazon add on? We know amlogic s905x does only 720p but there is another option for 4k/1080p with intel cpu? Even for libreelec is fine, not just under win10.
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