[sarbes]

My first hand experience was not too positive. Our GUI is running at 30fps in complex scenes (even the system GUI has issues). The bottleneck is the CPU, presumably throttling because of heat/power draw considerations. This was a bit surprising to me, as my other ARM devices have no such issues.

With some adjustment in font handling, I've managed to improve the CPU load in such cases by 8-10 fps. But stuttering on scene changes will remain.

We would have to split off the GUI engine and texture uploads into their own threads in order to get better frame rates.

[madmax2]

I think it depends on your definition of 'smooth'.  AIUI this device is still stuck at permanent 60Hz output - so any 24fps content will have 3:2 pull-down added, and any European 25/50Hz stuff will be even worse.

(I think unlike other Chromecast stuff it doesn't even allow the option of permanent 50Hz output?)

-AIUI this device is still stuck at permanent 60Hz output - so any 24fps content will have 3:2 pull-down added, and any European 25/50Hz stuff will be even worse.
I have no idea by what you mean by this... please clarify what actually happens (or show me a video or screenshot that has these issues) when the video is playing with 3:2 pull-down added..

Movies and most US scripted drama and comedy is shot at 23.976/24fps. To display this on broadcast TV in territories that have 59.94Hz TV (like North America, Japan, Korea etc.) you have to convert the 24fps to 60fps (*) and the standard way of doing this is 3:2 pull-down - which display one frame 3x, and the next frame just 2x. This asymmetry makes any linear motion judder. If you grew up watching it you may not notice it, but many do (particularly those of us in Europe who didn't see this much growing up). Some TVs can attempt to remove this by detecting 3:2 and removing it. However the best route to avoiding this 3:2 motion judder is to output 24fps video at 24Hz, then your TV can display this at 48Hz, 72Hz, 120Hz, 240Hz etc. by showing each frame 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, 10x etc. This means every frame is shown an equal amount of time and you have no judder.

Devices like the Apple TV, Amazon Fire Stick (**), NVIDIA Shield TV (**) and most LibreElec/CoreElec platforms can be configured to output 24/23.976fps stuff at 24/23.976Hz, 25/50fps stuff at 50Hz and 29.97/59.94Hz at 59.94Hz. This ensures no judder.

The Google Chromecast with Google TV is - or certainly was last time I checked - only capable of a fixed 59.94Hz output - so you get no option to playback content at the best frame rate for the content being played.

That fails my definition of smooth.

What is "3:2 pull-down added" and what is it mean "European 25/50Hz stuff will be even worse."

3:2 added is explained above (it's what you have to do to play 24Hz content at 60Hz (*) )

European TV content is shot at 25/50Hz - if you watch any European TV shows they will be either 25 or 50Hz releases usually. Playing this stuff at 59.94Hz means some frames are repeated, some aren't. On 50Hz native content you get 10Hz judder as one in every 5 frames is shown 2x. If you see that judder, you hate it. I do.

This too fails my definition of smooth.

I just watch movies and TV shows.. 
There's only a few movies that I watch in 4k (some are also in imax resolution) .. 
not sure what Hz they are or if they are 24fps or not.. 

If you grew up in North America and only watch North American content - you might be fine with 3:2 judder, and not be watching 25/50Hz European stuff.

If you are in Europe and grew up not watching 3:2, and want to watch 25/50Hz stuff in quality, then you may find the motion artefacts introduced by the Chromecast not nice to watch.

-I think it depends on your definition of 'smooth'.
I mean smoothly as in
-watchable video, that does not stutter, have artefacts (or any video image issues), audio issues (out of sync, no audio etc), no black screen.. etc. and anything else that would deem the video is unwatchable even if it can play the video..
Essentially like being able to watch a 1080p video/movie completely on any mediaplayers that can playback 1080p properly.

Note: I have now clarify it as watchable video, not playable video, since playable video can have video or audio issues, which means you wouldn't want to watch it anyway, due to it ruining the experience.

Also is there some bug/issue if we play 4k HDR files on 1080p (no HDR) TV or 4k (no HDR) TV?

In a nutshell is this device capable of outputting a watchable 4k 10bit HEVC HDR or not or I should consider another device like nvidia shield pro, odroid n2+, firetv 4k max etc?

Do you think long term wise which would be better buy, odroid N2+ or nvidia shield pro ?

I would chose either the N2+ or the NVIDIA Shield TV. The former is just a nice CoreElec experience, the latter gives you DRM support for Netflix, Prime, Disney etc. in UHD HDR.

I have all three devices. I never use the Chromecast.

Thanks for detail explanation.
Can you list all the devices you owned?

So you actually tested 4k 10 bit HEVC HDR on your own google chromecast with Google TV, and it was playable but had the judder, 3:2 pulldown issue?

I forgot mention some other alternative devices...e.g. HTPC

What do you think of going back to HTPC build?

At least we know that it will continue to have Kodi updates (since there will always be a windows or linux kodi releases etc.)
vs Nvidia shield, odroid etc.. which may stop getting updates after a few years..
Also with a decent HTPC build, it will last longer (and be more powerful) than a nvidia shield pro, odroid N2+ etc...
You can also upgrade your HTPC if you need to e.g. more ram, more storage, better CPU or GPU etc.

There's no incentives for Nvidia or odroid etc to keep supporting their own devices forever, since they would want you to buyer their newer models..
or the devices is just too old/weak and the update would just slow it down anyway..

e.g. pi3b+ (no longer has hardware acceleration on kodi 19).

[noggin]

Thanks for detail explanation.
Can you list all the devices you owned?

Odroid C2, C4, N2
Raspberry Pi all models from original B and A to 4B and Zero 2W.
NVIDIA Shield TV
Apple TV 4K v1 and v2
Various x86 boxes
Amazon Fire TV sticks of various flavours
Google Chromecast with Google TV
(Also some Rockchip stuff)

So you actually tested 4k 10 bit HEVC HDR on your own google chromecast with Google TV, and it was playable but had the judder, 3:2 pulldown issue?

No - didn't bother - no way I'm watching fixed 60Hz output for anybody.

What do you think of going back to HTPC build?

I stopped building HTPCs in the HD h.264 era. Haven't built any custom boxes for UHD h.265.

Don't like Windows as an HTPC OS and Linux on x86/x64 isn't there yet for UHD HDR (apart from some custom x86 builds for some more recent Intel CPU+GPU SoCs)

At the moment I don't see much point in a Linux or Windows HTPC for my use case.

e.g. pi3b+ (no longer has hardware acceleration on kodi 19).

That's a very different kettle of fish. Kodi and/or LibreElec developers have taken a move to standardise video playback upstream and not support 50,000 lines of patches that won't ever be upstreamed (i.e. Pi3B+ HEVC decode support). That's just a move to ensure Kodi itself continues to be developed - and moves it to be more platform neutral.

[zetruz]

I'm having problems with Kodi on this device. I run Jellyfin on my desktop PC, and connect to it on Kodi on the Chromecast with Google TV. This works just fine on my local network to my HDR-capable TV - HDR triggers and the video never stops to buffer or anything like that. Everything up to and including 4K remuxes plays just fine, in SDR and HDR10, in x264, and x265.

However, when I run it on another CCwGTV at my dad's place, connecting to my Jellyfin server and plugging the Chromecast into an older (SDR-only) TV, problems arise. 1080p Bluray remuxes play fine. 4K SDR webrips play fine. But 4K remuxes, whether SDR or HDR, those are problematic. 4K SDR remuxes stop to buffer very shortly after pressing play, and after a little bit it starts to buffer indefinitely and never resumes play.
On HDR videos, the whole UI lags out completely and I get the same buffering issue (though it takes a long time because the video/UI itself is lagging). I do not get any option to tonemap to SDR, no matter what video setting I use in the GGwGTV settings nor in Kodi.
So. Is the system incapable of doing HDR tonemapping? And why the heck would it struggle with high-bitrate SDR content over internet but not over local network? (Speed tests on both ends indicate the network performance is way higher than necessary.)

[noggin]

And why the heck would it struggle with high-bitrate SDR content over internet but not over local network? (Speed tests on both ends indicate the network performance is way higher than necessary.)

Network latency and jitter can be significantly worse over WAN than LAN connections.  You may be able to mitigate this by increasing the buffer size that Kodi uses - possibly in the advanced settings xml file - but I've not used Android TV for this type of stuff so can't advise the route to do this.

I've seen other reports about Tonemapping causing issues with this platform.

I've retired this as a spare bedroom TV dongle to let visitors watch Netflix - had too many compromises as a main or secondary viewing platform for me. (Got a very heavy discount on it so I don't feel too bad. It's a pity - it's a nice piece of industrial design and the remote is OK)

[Dragon 548]

Hi,
I recently purchased a Chromecast with Google tv. I previously had a Xiaomi Mibox 3 and overall I'm happy with the much faster Chromecast. I use this one in particular to play videos stored on my Synology NAS via KODI. I have no problem playing x264 videos of around 20 gigs. Reading a file in x265 (HEVC) format does not work correctly, however: it is very jerky (an image every 2/3 seconds and sound does not work correctly). I tried with several files and the result is always the same. My old Mibox 3 played these files perfectly, so I think the Chromecast must be able to do this too.
Can you help me ?
Thanks in advance.

Here is the link of the log: https://paste.kodi.tv/sukanoloqu
I think the lines that interest you start at 21:09:32.645

[noggin]

Hi,
I recently purchased a Chromecast with Google tv. I previously had a Xiaomi Mibox 3 and overall I'm happy with the much faster Chromecast. I use this one in particular to play videos stored on my Synology NAS via KODI. I have no problem playing x264 videos of around 20 gigs. Reading a file in x265 (HEVC) format does not work correctly, however: it is very jerky (an image every 2/3 seconds and sound does not work correctly). I tried with several files and the result is always the same. My old Mibox 3 played these files perfectly, so I think the Chromecast must be able to do this too.
Can you help me ?
Thanks in advance.

Here is the link of the log: https://paste.kodi.tv/sukanoloqu
I think the lines that interest you start at 21:09:32.645

Are you running with an SDR TV ? There appears to be a known issue with UHD HDR replay in SDR on the Chromecast. (i.e. it doesn't have hardware accelerated tone mapping - at least within Kodi - currently)?

Are the HEVC/h.265 files you are playing UHD HDR (i.e. UHD Blu-ray rips)?

[Dragon 548]

Thanks for your return.
Yes I have an SDR TV (a Samsung which is 10 years old).
Yes the files in h265 that I read are indeed UHD Blu-ray rips.
Is there any solution to fix this problem or not?
Because if I understand correctly it's not due to Kodi but to Chromecast.
Changing playback by switching to VLC for example will be useless I imagine?

[noggin]

Thanks for your return.
Yes I have an SDR TV (a Samsung which is 10 years old).
Yes the files in h265 that I read are indeed UHD Blu-ray rips.
Is there any solution to fix this problem or not?
Because if I understand correctly it's not due to Kodi but to Chromecast.
Changing playback by switching to VLC for example will be useless I imagine?

AIUI there is no current fix for this. I don't know if it's related to the version of Android TV running on the Chromecast not exposing a hardware-accelerated HDR->SDR tone map, or whether the hardware doesn't support it. (The Chromecast in question is based on an AMLogic SoC though - and they do handle HDR->SDR hardware accelerated tone mapping on other software platforms like CoreElec ISTR)

My guess is that there is no 'regular' use case for tone mapping on the Chromecast as all the main DRM streaming services will have SDR UHD streams that will be sent to a device connected to an SDR display and requesting SDR content? (i.e. Netflix and Prime Video won't require tone mapping from HDR to SDR on their player devices, they will just send an SDR version instead?)

[racecar]

My guess is that there is no 'regular' use case for tone mapping on the Chromecast as all the main DRM streaming services will have SDR UHD streams that will be sent to a device connected to an SDR display and requesting SDR content? (i.e. Netflix and Prime Video won't require tone mapping from HDR to SDR on their player devices, they will just send an SDR version instead?)

The issue seems to be specifically with the PQ (SMPTE ST 2084) TRC, which is not backwards-compatible with SDR. If GTV allowed apps to direct-play it on an SDR display, those files would run smoothly but the gamma curve would make them look washed out. I believe all streaming services provide some kind of SDR solution (either in the form of a fallback stream as you surmised, or an HDR TLC that's backwards compatible, like HLG), so the simplest solution would be just get those files and not the PQ ones.

[noggin]

My guess is that there is no 'regular' use case for tone mapping on the Chromecast as all the main DRM streaming services will have SDR UHD streams that will be sent to a device connected to an SDR display and requesting SDR content? (i.e. Netflix and Prime Video won't require tone mapping from HDR to SDR on their player devices, they will just send an SDR version instead?)

The issue seems to be specifically with the PQ (SMPTE ST 2084) TRC, which is not backwards-compatible with SDR. If GTV allowed apps to direct-play it on an SDR display, those files would run smoothly but the gamma curve would make them look washed out. I believe all streaming services provide some kind of SDR solution (either in the form of a fallback stream as you surmised, or an HDR TLC that's backwards compatible, like HLG), so the simplest solution would be just get those files and not the PQ ones.

Yes - for commercial subscription services it's a non-issue AIUI - the Chromecast will stream the PQ versions in Rec 2020 if it's connected to a PQ display, and the SDR versions in Rec 709 if it's connected to an SDR display. No problem. (BTW it's technically the EOTF - Electro Optical Transfer Function - that is the HDR vs SDR dynamic range difference - which isn't quite the same thing as gamma, though SDR's EOTF is often defined as a Power Law gamma)

The issue is local media replay where you only have a Rec 2020 HDR version of a movie or TV show and want to play it on a Chromecast with Google TV on an SDR display (and probably in Rec 709) and thus the Chromecast needs to do a Tonemapping conversion, which causes it to grind to a halt. That's where the platform appears to fall over.  Presumably because the device is optimised for OTT DRMed services which don't need it to do that...

[Soli]

Apparent Plex is able to do local tonemapping, but it's a preview function for paid subscribers, meaning I don't know how well it works. On the Atv4k, the tonemapping seems to be built-in.

[noggin]

Apparent Plex is able to do local tonemapping, but it's a preview function for paid subscribers, meaning I don't know how well it works. On the Atv4k, the tonemapping seems to be built-in.

Yes - CoreElec on some of the AMLogic platforms also has built-in tone mapping support.

[racecar]

The tone mapping feature advertised as a Plex Pass preview is a server side one, applied when transcoding. I don't think there's any client side tone mapping from Plex.

I've used Mi Box S, Shield and ATV in the same scenario–they do apply tone mapping client side where CGTV does not. Unfortunately CGTV is the only one I currently own. :/

[wasssu]

What are the best settings for AdvancedSettings.xml that you are using? I can't get rid of the stuttering.