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DSPlayer (DirectShow Player for XBMC) Frodo build available
(2015-03-25, 10:33)oldpoem Wrote:
(2015-03-25, 09:18)Warner306 Wrote: More observations/questions:

1. There is an inconsistency with how menus work. If I change a setting in Kodi, the same setting is changed in the madVR configuration panels. But, if I change a setting in the madVR configuration panel, the Kodi gui does not report this change. This can be very confusing, as the gui may report chroma upscaling as Bicubic 75, but I already changed it to Bicubic 100 in madVR. The two menus should be in-sync.

2. Some of the video settings need to be greyed-out when the Kodi gui is disabled. I can still adjust image scaling from this screen even though the scaling option does nothing.

3. The Kodi gui becomes very laggy and unresponsive while a video is played.

4. I don't have any 3D LUTs to test, but I question whether gamma processing is working correctly.

My reference image is MPC-BE with LAV Filters. The two are very close, but Kodi displays more noise and is more washed out. I don't think this is an issue with 0-255 vs 16-235 levels, as it isn't that dramatic. I'm not sure if this a weakness of DSPlayer or something that needs to be adjusted. Everything still looks great, but it is not reference. This is why I question if my gamma settings of 2.2 is being respected by DSPlayer. MPC-BE is sharper.

5. Lastly, Full screen exclusive mode can cause crashes if a graphics card does not support it. The screen will turn black before freezing.

I'll post a debug log on the exclusive mode crash.

I plan to post a complete configuration guide of DSPlayer with LAV Filters and madVR on the weekend. Most of it is written already. The madVR portion requires some work.

1. Those 2 menu should not be in-sync, as aracnoz said when you use Kodi GUI it's per file setting not global. So DSPlayer save settings per file. What you change in external madvr panel should not related to Kodi MadVR settings unless you uncheck use Kodi GUI settings. But there is prbably something amiss like when you changed something via GUI it would change MadVR settings while it's playing but when you stop global values maynot return to former values. But I haven't looked into it. Because it's irrelevant to Kodi MadVR settings, DSPlayer would load its own madvr config value everytime it play media.

3. Kodi GUI here works fine with remote. There is rare delay when bring out home menu when the video is playing but it navigates fine.

4. As aracnoz said in DSPlayer it's per file settings and irrelevant from global madvr settings. So what you set outside shouldn't affect DSPlayer MadVR unless you disable Kodi MadVR gui settings.

Changes made to madVR outside Kodi do effect Kodi. I tested. The behavior is exactly as I described.
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It might make sense to test with a movie and then try to screenshot the *exact* same video frame. Then you can load both screenshots into MS Paint and switch between them via Alt-Tab. For screenshotting to work, you should probably temporarily disable madVR's FSE mode (if you have it activated).
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(2015-03-25, 10:36)madshi Wrote: It might make sense to test with a movie and then try to screenshot the *exact* same video frame. Then you can load both screenshots into MS Paint and switch between them via Alt-Tab. For screenshotting to work, you should probably temporarily disable madVR's FSE mode (if you have it activated).

Sure, I will most certainly do that when I have time.
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(2015-03-25, 10:35)Warner306 Wrote: Changes made to madVR outside Kodi do effect Kodi. I tested. The behavior is exactly as I described.

If it changes during playback it should, but should not if you change it before loading kodi because then it will be global value and Kodi didn;t use global value if selected using Kodi GUI.

I tried and Kodi load my per file settings everytime, not global value.

I think what you tried is not what by designed, the value in GUI is what keep in DSPlayer db. If you change MadVR settings through panel not GUI during playback that value would effect video but won't be remember nor save by Kodi. And it should stay that way by design.
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@aracnoz - you're the man - this is fab work - huge well done. Off to test.

Huge thanks also to Madshi, without who's assistance this would never have come to fruition.
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(2015-03-25, 10:24)madshi Wrote: Thanks a lot to aracnoz for his work! Big Grin

Some comments:

1) I've no idea why image quality would be different when comparing dsplayer and MPC-HC, it should be identical. I think some more tests need to be done there. Maybe you guys could try some test pattern videos and make screenshots and compare them? It could be as simple as the video levels output option (0-255 vs 16-235), or it could be something completely different. If you notice differences in sharpness, maybe the scaling algorithms are not properly set? The next madVR build will show in the debug OSD (Ctrl+J) which exact scaling algorithms are being used. You could also compare what the debug OSD (Ctrl+J) says right now. Is there any obvious difference between dsplayer and MPC-HC? E.g. different source or target rects or something?

2) XBMC GUI is expected to be more sluggish when using madVR. The reason for this is that madVR renders many video frames in advance and sends them to Direct3D. The purpose of this is that Direct3D has enough information to continue video playback even if the CPU/GPU gets extra busy and doesn't allow madVR to render something for a short period. E.g. imagine anti-virus software suddenly comes on and takes the whole CPU busy for 200ms. Due to the way madVR already sends multiple video frames to Direct3D in advance, this is not a problem. Movie playback will stay totally fluid. The negative side effect of this functionality is that madVR can't update frames which were already sent to Direct3D. As a result, if XBMC tries to show its GUI, it takes several frames until the GUI becomes visible, because Direct3D still has to display all the other frames first, which were already pre-rendered by madVR.

Ok, so much about the technical explanation. Now you can influence the XBMC GUI lag by modifying the madVR settings. Specifically you can modify the setting "how many video frames shall be presented in advance" this will have a direct effect on the GUI lag. Decrease this setting to reduce the GUI lag. But if you decrease this setting, you also decrease the protection against stuttering if the CPU/GPU gets busy for a short period (see above).

3) Those crashes, are they in madVR or in XBMC? When madVR crashes, you should get a madExcept crash report box, where you can see details of the crash and you can send/email it to me. If XBMC crashes, I don't know how that will look.

FWIW, there will be a new madVR release very soon with several bugfixes and some stability improvements.

Thanks for your help Madshi on making this happen....happy days!
Sapphire RX 5700 XT (19.9.2)  Ryzen 7 3700x, PRIME X570-Pro, Win 10 x64 (1903), Silverstone LC13B-E, Onkyo TX-NR686, Philips 55PUS6754/12, Mission M35i speakers, Kodi Dsplayer 17.6 X64
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(2015-03-24, 20:50)Warner306 Wrote:
(2015-03-24, 11:46)Bjur Wrote: I am definately looking forward to your MadVR + ffdraw guide WarnerSmile I have LAV and only defined ffdraw in mediaconfig (don't know if that the best approach to use ffdraw).

I have A8-7600 AMD with 384 shaders. Would that be able to use madvr in good conditions?

And finally thanks a lot aracnoz for you big effort on this "madder"Smile. I looks like you are the one to finally pull it off..

There is already a detailed guide on using ffdraw with madVR. It is in one of the most recent posts in this thread.

I started a guide on configuring DSPlayer with LAV Filters and madVR. The resizing algorithms in madVR are superior to ffdraw. However, ffdraw allows post-processing that can add sharpening effects, remove grain, etc. It is a totally different approach to image rendering that can yield results similar to madVR + LAV.
I already have DSPlayer configured with LAV Filter. So if I understand correct. It's either ffdraw with LAV filters and LAV Filters with MadVR? I will definately try out MadVR, There are several link, so I will see what makes most sense and see if I can get it working and when it comes look to your guide to see if it's configured the same way of if I missed something.
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(2015-03-25, 15:01)Bjur Wrote: I already have DSPlayer configured with LAV Filter. So if I understand correct. It's either ffdraw with LAV filters and LAV Filters with MadVR? I will definately try out MadVR, There are several link, so I will see what makes most sense and see if I can get it working and when it comes look to your guide to see if it's configured the same way of if I missed something.

No, you can have DSPlayer with LAV Filters , FFDShow and MadVR altogether. I'm using it right now. But with all these altogether be sure to not do same thing by two or more software.

For example you don't want to deinterlace more than once, so choose what you want to deinterlace with and don't enable deinterlace in others. I went with deinterlacing in LAVFilters and disable it in FFDShow RAW and MadVR. NVidia HW Deinterlacing in LAVFilters tends to be better than software deinterlacing like YADIF in FFDShow / MadVR.

Also you might want to use FFDShow RAW profiles to apply some post-processing to deblock those SD DivX/XVid files too. And you can also test & compare those scaling option (AVISynth Spline64resize etc. in FFDShow RAW & Jinc etc. in MadVR).

But you don't want to sharpen before scaling though. So if you decide to use MadVR to do scaling. Be sure to disable any sharpening in FFDShow.

There are a lot trial & error you can try. My suggestion is don't totally believe anything you read that would be best, try and see for yourself which you prefer.

Also SVP should works as well with FFDShow & MadVR but I'm not a fan so didn't try.

Thanks to Aracnoz & Madshi for giving us this wonderful piece of software. Happy experiment!
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@madshi
I wanna seize the oportunity to thank u for ur patiente and helping attitude. For DSPlayer users this is huge cool step forward.
And thank u Aracnoz for not giving up.


(2015-03-25, 10:34)Warner306 Wrote: I will do more tests with image quality differences, but they do look different to my eyes. I have been glued to MPC-BE broadcasting for a long time and know that I am sensitive to this. It is very hard to determine why the image is different (or if this even matters) by switching back and forth between players because the switch is not immediate and I have to regain my place in the video.

There's a 0-255 and limited range switcher in one of the menus in Kodi Settings, do u think it could have something to do with it? , though i guess it's only applied to DVDPlayer. But i don't know.
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there are other things to do with madVR and kodi, some crash that never happened during my test in debug occurs with the exe included in the setup, i have to work on this for sure, this is just a first release, but now i have to take a break...

for some questions that was asked at the beginning has already been given a valid response ...

so for the moment I just wanted to add something on the comparison between mpc and kodi

Here are a few screenshots I made very quickly

as you can see grayscale and color are the same ... as we know evr sometimes oversaturated some colors... but madVR works the same way on mpc and kodi

I tried a few movies with a resolution lower than 1080p and is clearly visible the difference between DSPlayer evr and DSPlayer madVR

here some screenshots

evr_1_dsplayer
Image

madvr_1_dsplayer
Image

madvr_1_mpc-hc
Image


evr_2_dsplayer
Image

madvr_2_dsplayer
Image

madvr_2_mpc-hc
Image
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@Martijn this is definitely front page blog worthy.
Image
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(2015-03-25, 18:18)Talguy Wrote: @Martijn this is definitely front page blog worthy.

+1
Sapphire RX 5700 XT (19.9.2)  Ryzen 7 3700x, PRIME X570-Pro, Win 10 x64 (1903), Silverstone LC13B-E, Onkyo TX-NR686, Philips 55PUS6754/12, Mission M35i speakers, Kodi Dsplayer 17.6 X64
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(2015-03-25, 00:45)aracnoz Wrote: and stop ... so who was taking the time? how long it took me to integrate madVR into DSPlayer?

a bit of irony for one of the most difficult things I've done with DSPlayer
I would like to thank madshi ... I contacted him on doom9 having 0 posts, and with no credibility in the community and was immediately available and he has always helped me with infinite patience
in the last few days I asked for advice even on what to wear in the morning Big Grin, without his help I would definitely integrated madVR because I have a hard head, but with his help it was all much easier and faster

thank you madshi...

How much good is the integration of madVR in DSPlayer? ... honestly I have no idea, I have to admit that I never used madVR continuously because I love the XBMC gui so I do not know nothing about all his infinite power
so maybe it will be you to tell me... certain is that I had never seen a gui so advanced as that of kodi that works on madVR, i'm very proud of the final result

some details...

Now in Video Renderer there is a list, so madvr will appear if it's installed in the system

when we select madVR as renderer kodi shows two options

The first one allows you to choose if to use the gui of kodi to configure some of the most important madVR options, on the advice of madshi I included this possibility because some more advanced users have created profiles on madVR that probably don't want to lose

if we use the interface of kodi to configure the settings of madVR, for every video will be stored the custom settings, i created a table in dsplayer database with all madvr options, so the behavior it's as with normal video settings of kodi... you can also change the default values and then assign them to all videos

the second option in the menu DSPlayer on madvr it's to enable the fullscreen exclusive mode of madVR, to make madvr work in exclusive mode i had to force kodi in windowed mode... so when we select madvr as video renderer kodi will work only in windowed mode in this way madvr can use his own exclusive mode
(the point is or madvr goes in exclusive mode or kodi... infact madvr it's like another window)

one last note it's on NNEDI3 double settings, there are many rules on how and when you can turn on the different options, the trayicon of madVR follows these rules, the interface that i had use to set madVR no, so I could not replicate all these rules

so to make it work properly you must know what you are doing


it is time to test... everything it's in my signature

so i decided to stop by ...as i do so every so often .. you know xD

communication with tiben20 died down , i must sadly report

so i login and what da f do i see here

o...m ...g!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! finally !!!!!!! madvr dsplayer !!!! all these years of keeping up hope paid off!, now its up to testing , i hope all my dreams have come true, ill be back with some feedback then as soon as properly tested, thanks aracnoz in advance a ton for this great job, and i cant wait for the stable build release of this ,but as said ill be testing this baby asap

and finally of course a huge thank you goes out to the grandmaster of videoquality codecs aka Madshi , thanks man for all your help and great to see you on kodi forums every so often bro
Reply
(2015-03-25, 16:45)aracnoz Wrote: there are other things to do with madVR and kodi, some crash that never happened during my test in debug occurs with the exe included in the setup, i have to work on this for sure, this is just a first release, but now i have to take a break...

for some questions that was asked at the beginning has already been given a valid response ...

so for the moment I just wanted to add something on the comparison between mpc and kodi

Here are a few screenshots I made very quickly

as you can see grayscale and color are the same ... as we know evr sometimes oversaturated some colors... but madVR works the same way on mpc and kodi

I tried a few movies with a resolution lower than 1080p and is clearly visible the difference between DSPlayer evr and DSPlayer madVR

here some screenshots

evr_1_dsplayer
Image

madvr_1_dsplayer
Image

madvr_1_mpc-hc
Image


evr_2_dsplayer
Image

madvr_2_dsplayer
Image

madvr_2_mpc-hc
Image


It does look very similar. Now that I understand the issue with global profiles vs per video profiles, I will do some further testing myself. The image looks sharper with MPC-BE on my screen.
Reply
(2015-03-25, 19:48)hentai23 Wrote:
(2015-03-25, 00:45)aracnoz Wrote: and stop ... so who was taking the time? how long it took me to integrate madVR into DSPlayer?

a bit of irony for one of the most difficult things I've done with DSPlayer
I would like to thank madshi ... I contacted him on doom9 having 0 posts, and with no credibility in the community and was immediately available and he has always helped me with infinite patience
in the last few days I asked for advice even on what to wear in the morning Big Grin, without his help I would definitely integrated madVR because I have a hard head, but with his help it was all much easier and faster

thank you madshi...

How much good is the integration of madVR in DSPlayer? ... honestly I have no idea, I have to admit that I never used madVR continuously because I love the XBMC gui so I do not know nothing about all his infinite power
so maybe it will be you to tell me... certain is that I had never seen a gui so advanced as that of kodi that works on madVR, i'm very proud of the final result

some details...

Now in Video Renderer there is a list, so madvr will appear if it's installed in the system

when we select madVR as renderer kodi shows two options

The first one allows you to choose if to use the gui of kodi to configure some of the most important madVR options, on the advice of madshi I included this possibility because some more advanced users have created profiles on madVR that probably don't want to lose

if we use the interface of kodi to configure the settings of madVR, for every video will be stored the custom settings, i created a table in dsplayer database with all madvr options, so the behavior it's as with normal video settings of kodi... you can also change the default values and then assign them to all videos

the second option in the menu DSPlayer on madvr it's to enable the fullscreen exclusive mode of madVR, to make madvr work in exclusive mode i had to force kodi in windowed mode... so when we select madvr as video renderer kodi will work only in windowed mode in this way madvr can use his own exclusive mode
(the point is or madvr goes in exclusive mode or kodi... infact madvr it's like another window)

one last note it's on NNEDI3 double settings, there are many rules on how and when you can turn on the different options, the trayicon of madVR follows these rules, the interface that i had use to set madVR no, so I could not replicate all these rules

so to make it work properly you must know what you are doing


it is time to test... everything it's in my signature

so i decided to stop by ...as i do so every so often .. you know xD

communication with tiben20 died down , i must sadly report

so i login and what da f do i see here

o...m ...g!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! finally !!!!!!! madvr dsplayer !!!! all these years of keeping up hope paid off!, now its up to testing , i hope all my dreams have come true, ill be back with some feedback then as soon as properly tested, thanks aracnoz in advance a ton for this great job, and i cant wait for the stable build release of this ,but as said ill be testing this baby asap

and finally of course a huge thank you goes out to the grandmaster of videoquality codecs aka Madshi , thanks man for all your help and great to see you on kodi forums every so often bro

LOL wondered how long it would take for you to surface.
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