[HeadLearning]

First of all, thank you to all of the skinners out there. It is no easy task.

That being said, until an alpha is available can we please separate mockups from the actually functionally available working WIP skins? I have been noticing an upswing in vitriol by users who browse this subforum looking to test a functional (albeit an early alpha) skin. Animosity appears to be brewing between end users who are teased via photoshop mockups only to never see the skins come to fruition. We get it. You are actively coding. But until the skin can be installed, it should be marked as concept.

Is there any way to create two exclusive subsections for the WIP skin area? Or maybe a new dropdown menu item that includes CONCEPT as opposed to "Work In Progress" which should technically be used for functional works in progress.

Thoughts?

[ronie]

separate forums is gonna be a bit difficult, as people can't move their own posts from one forum to another.
which will probably put a lot more work on moderators to move skin threads during the several stages of development.

having some additional posts [tags] available seems to most suiting solution in my opinion.
they are already widely used in this section, we just need to define when to us what.

for instance:
[Concept] - only mockups/screenshots are available
[WIP] - actual coding of the skin has started, but no download available yet.
[Release] - development still in process, but initial test versions are available for download

is this something that would work? other ideas?

when we can settle on a definite list (please keep it simple), i don't mind going through the first few pages
of the WIP forum to correctly tag the thread titles.

[drivesoslow]

I think the tags are a great idea

[HeadLearning]

separate forums is gonna be a bit difficult, as people can't move their own posts from one forum to another.
which will probably put a lot more work on moderators to move skin threads during the several stages of development.

having some additional posts [tags] available seems to most suiting solution in my opinion.
they are already widely used in this section, we just need to define when to us what.

for instance:
[Concept] - only mockups/screenshots are available
[WIP] - actual coding of the skin has started, but no download available yet.
[Beta] - development still in process, but initial test versions are available for download

is this something that would work? other ideas?

when we can settle on a definite list (please keep it simple), i don't mind going through the first few pages
of the WIP forum to correctly tag the thread titles.

+1 for this idea. I'd also add a tag for dead or abandoned projects. Skinners often start interesting ideas but eventually merge that into another concept (See: Mimic) or abandon the idea completely in favor of another project that interests them more.

[Piers]

I don't see why we can't have a Concept sub-forum and a WIP sub-forum, it only means creating an additional sub-forum for Skin Development and any concepts can be moved there (maybe only ones created within a six month period) and any future ones can be put in there.

So the forum flow would be:

Development
- Skin Development
-- WIP Skins
-- Concept Skins


Certainly more tags in general would be useful.

[Mod]
Release covers alpha/beta/RC/etc as far as I'm concerned.
Work In Progress already exists.

That's my two cents.

[jurialmunkey]

I think a concept sub forum could work well - just put everything that doesn't have an alpha/beta/rc publically available in there and make it a requirement of the WIP forum that skin threads must have something people can test. Tags in the concept forum can differentiate between skins actually being developed and those that are just mockups. The main problem would be that mods would need to actively monitor the forum to move stuff over to the WIP forum when a public version becomes available (perhaps a tag can be used to alert mods about this).

More tags like [Beta] [Alpha] [RC] etc. would benefit the wip forum greatly in terms of structure. I also wouldn't mind some sort of hiatus type tag: v2 of Arctic works for Gotham and is available for download but I'm no longer developing it. I am slowly developing a v3 but Eminence and other life commitments are priorities, and I wont be releasing anything until its at beta stage (likely another 6 months). But I still want to leave the thread there so people can download v2 if they wish.

[testmetest]

for instance:
[Concept] - only mockups/screenshots are available
[WIP] - actual coding of the skin has started, but no download available yet.
[Beta] - development still in process, but initial test versions are available for download

I like the idea. But I'll end up forgetting the difference between WIP and beta. Perhaps:

[Unreleased] - concept, coding, not yet installable
[WIP] - installable, still working on it
[Released] - installable, only minor tweaks needed

[HeadLearning]

for instance:
[Concept] - only mockups/screenshots are available
[WIP] - actual coding of the skin has started, but no download available yet.
[Beta] - development still in process, but initial test versions are available for download

I like the idea. But I'll end up forgetting the difference between WIP and beta. Perhaps:

[Unreleased] - concept, coding, not yet installable
[WIP] - installable, still working on it
[Released] - installable, only minor tweaks needed

All of these skins are WIP. That tag has to be removed. Marking anything [WIP] is pointless because literally all threads in this subforum should be about a work in progress skin.

The more promenant issue at hand which is...when a skin is marked as "Work In Progress" but the end user is not able to download. I propose if no downloads are available, thread shall be marked as concept. We just need to settle on a naming convention.

[Concept] (mock ups or videos only)
[Alpha] (testing only, with complete sections missing)
[Beta] (something that more closely resembles a functional product)
[Release](which technically means the skin can leave the WIP section of the forums)

[jurialmunkey]

@HeadLearning. I like those. I think we also need something to differentiate between concepts that are mock-ups only and those being coded but not released (e.g. Fuse). Many skinners prefer to skip the alpha stage whilst still developing their ideas because otherwise users get too invested in how something was previously and we end up with option bloat trying to satisfy multiple users.

Also, as official repo releases will move to their own forums, I suggest the following for a "release" tag:
[Release Candidate] - A skin ready for release and going for official repo inclusion. Usually takes a few rounds before they get accepted.
[Release] - A skin that is out of the beta phase but will never be on the official repo for whatever reason (e.g. Immersive because of font licensing issues).

[HeadLearning]

How about a functional concept tag?

[Hitcher]

As this is specifically a 'WIP Skins' forum I don't really see the need for any more than the following tags.

[Concept] mocked up skins
[WIP] working skins
[Release] any form of working skin for public use

Any more and I personally think you'll over complicate what is after all a section really "for skinners only".

[HeadLearning]

I agree, I think the contetntion lies in the vagueness of the WIP tag. A skin that is marked as WIP but isn't available for anyone to download can be frustrating. That tag is being used for both functional concepts and mockups which I think is confusing.

[ronie]

ok, let's settle for that then.

i've created the 'Concept' tag (we already had 'WIP' and 'Release' tags)
i'll go through the first few pages of the WIP forum and adjust the post titles asap.

[ronie]

Certainly more tags in general would be useful.

[Mod]

agreed, that could be really useful in the regular skin forums, where skin mods are often posted.

[HeadLearning]

ok, let's settle for that then.

i've created the 'Concept' tag (we already had 'WIP' and 'Release' tags)
i'll go through the first few pages of the WIP forum and adjust the post titles asap.

Thanks ronie. IMHO any skin that isn't functionally available for download should be marked as concept, even if the skin is actively being worked on.