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blazin912 · 2016-02-24, 04:15

Soooooo... when are we getting the protocol back? It's inevitable, start working on it.

I've been using my Dual for a long time with XBMC and now Kodi, I didn't know why the Jarvis build I tried last week didn't tune my HDHR properly, I thought I did something wrong, but now that it's fully released and I've stumbled across this thread, I'm just annoyed by this terrible decision.

I'll revert and I guess deal with all the bugs that come with that task because I rely on my HDHR Dual for my household's source of OTA content and I know I'm not the only one combining your SW and SiliconDust's hardware in this way.

**DarrenHill** · (This post was last modified: 2016-02-24, 08:51 by DarrenHill.)

A friendly word of advice, posts and attitude like that are likely to ensure that no-one works on it and it doesn't return...

~~Ned Scott~~ · (This post was last modified: 2016-02-24, 10:14 by Ned Scott.)

Normally I would agree, but a fully functional feature was removed because a replacement was assumed, but was never made (and I think people confused this protocol with the TvHeadend protocol that was also removed). This isn't people being mad that no one worked on something. Instead, this is being mad that something was removed for no reason.

I don't have one of the older (but not outdated, to be clear) tuners, but I sympathize.

blazin912 · 2016-02-25, 00:49

(2016-02-24, 10:05)Ned Scott Wrote: Normally I would agree, but a fully functional feature was removed because a replacement was assumed, but was never made (and I think people confused this protocol with the TvHeadend protocol that was also removed). This isn't people being mad that no one worked on something. Instead, this is being mad that something was removed for no reason.

I don't have one of the older (but not outdated, to be clear) tuners, but I sympathize.

Precisely, I'm not issuing and enhancment request, or bug report, I'm stating a fully functional feature was deprecated without a backwards compatible solution in place.

It's not like that protocol broke things.. I can't imagine including it is THAT big of an architectural impact to warrant not providing some support either by add-on breakout or reincorporation.

perfectcolors · (This post was last modified: 2016-02-25, 05:45 by perfectcolors.)

Part of what makes this frustrating is that it was acknowledged internally that removing support for older HDHomeRun units would result in angry users.

Well, this is the result.

I don't really know what end-users can do to oppose a decision that was made 7 months ago when the devs involved have already fully considered the implications of their actions and proceeded anyway.

~~Ned Scott~~ · 2016-02-25, 05:56

It's frustrating, but the way forward now is to find someone willing to complete Spiff's (ironic_monkey) work and make the HDHomeRun protocol into an actual file system add-on.

It might be possible to get some unofficial or otherwise rebranded builds of Kodi v16 to add the feature back in, but I can't make any promises, as that's something I cannot do on my own.

blazin912 · 2016-02-25, 23:51

Can you post a link to the git for this work? I can surely try to make the add-on. I am capable bit somewhat strapped on time.

I'll review and see if I can fix

blazin912 · 2016-02-28, 05:26

So.... More people upgrading, more people having feature loss annoyance?

~~Ned Scott~~ · 2016-02-28, 06:39

(2016-02-25, 23:51)blazin912 Wrote: Can you post a link to the git for this work? I can surely try to make the add-on. I am capable bit somewhat strapped on time.

I'll review and see if I can fix

I think maybe this: https://github.com/notspiff/vfs.hdhomerun

notspiff/ironic_monkey would know more.

binaryjay · 2016-03-04, 04:23

I got screwed on this too. I'm going to have to break out of KODI and start something else like VLC or WMP every time my kids want to watch sunday cartoons etc. again. I'm not going to stay on an old version just for this. Doesn't make sense to deprecate a function that works fine and didn't impact anybody that didn't use it "just because" if you ask me, without providing a workaround.

The newer HDHR units are harder and harder to find, expensive, and would offer nothing for me that I wasn't already getting using the ones I already own.

perfectcolors · 2016-03-04, 04:51

I was considering just biting the bullet and buying a newer HDHR unit but after looking at the prices they go for now I quickly changed my mind.

As much as I don't want to do it I'll likely be rolling back to v15.2. Hopefully this issue is addressed by the time Krypton is released next year.

Good luck guys Sad

blazin912 · 2016-03-05, 21:38

How many people need to post before we get a rollback? Its probably easier to include this back into the build than to port an add-on.

teaguecl · 2016-03-12, 19:26

I'd like to add my voice to the unhappy users here. I have the HDHR3 and HDHR4 and am out in the cold, without even an obscure note in the release notes to warn me. As a 12+ year user of XBMP/XBMC/Kodi and an occasional code and wiki contributor, this is certainly frustrating. I'll see if I can help with the binary add-on.

On a related but tangential note, I think the "new kids" are doing a terrible job. In my decade of XBMC use, I've never seen more broken features, crashes, and random direction changes than in the last three years. The Linux builds are now afterthoughts. The recent Estuary reveal is another example. From the blog post:

"Many months of hard work have been put into these...members Phil65, Piers and ronie have been working in secret creating.."

That's not how open source works. Going off to work in secret so you can have an Apple-style reveal? I don't care if you want a new default skin - it's your product, do what you want. But if you want me to contribute, stop treating me like the product. The secrecy, the not-invented-here and the distrust of non-Team developers is really why I stopped contributing at all. Getting a working tested patch submitted took me months of political effort, while "Team" members put in broken code (and apparently delete working code) without question, screaming "RERO" all the way.
As much as I've loved my time with this product, it's simply allowed the competition to close the gap. Kodi isn't that compelling anymore, and dealing with the new team leadership - even as an end user - has been awful.

~~Ned Scott~~ · 2016-03-12, 20:26

I can see what you're saying, but it's not that black and white.

Nor was the intention for the skin to be an Apple-like reveal. They had their reasons, and like I said, it's not black and white. You can easily have a "too many cooks in the kitchen" issue with something like that. This isn't a static skin; it will continue to evolve. They just wanted to get a strong start on it, mostly for technical reasons, I think. I think it would have been possible to have been more public about it, but I don't think it would have mattered that much ether way. It's public now, and people can contribute now.

Which isn't to say that you're right or wrong. There is a big issue with "not-invented-here" or at least the assumption that "outsiders" are stupid and imposing on an inner circle, but even that isn't so black and white, because not everyone feels that way. Also, it's really not a "new" thing or due to "new leadership". Part of this is what happens with a volunteer open source project that lacks real defined boundaries. (For a lack of better words). It worked in the original Xbox days because it was a smaller group (I assume. I didn't know the guys back then), but now it's a much bigger project, with more platforms, and more features, and more room for error and disagreement. (Again, for a lack of better words)

People aren't perfect, and this project attracts many "young" developers. Don't crap on them for making a mistake. Then they just learn to hate the user/community because they are so insulted, after pouring their heart and soul into something. I know it's frustrating, but it's very important to be constructive at this stage.

Rickt1962 · 2016-03-12, 20:40

(2016-03-12, 19:26)teaguecl Wrote: I'd like to add my voice to the unhappy users here. I have the HDHR3 and HDHR4 and am out in the cold, without even an obscure note in the release notes to warn me. As a 12+ year user of XBMP/XBMC/Kodi and an occasional code and wiki contributor, this is certainly frustrating. I'll see if I can help with the binary add-on.

On a related but tangential note, I think the "new kids" are doing a terrible job. In my decade of XBMC use, I've never seen more broken features, crashes, and random direction changes than in the last three years. The Linux builds are now afterthoughts. The recent Estuary reveal is another example. From the blog post:

"Many months of hard work have been put into these...members Phil65, Piers and ronie have been working in secret creating.."

That's not how open source works. Going off to work in secret so you can have an Apple-style reveal? I don't care if you want a new default skin - it's your product, do what you want. But if you want me to contribute, stop treating me like the product. The secrecy, the not-invented-here and the distrust of non-Team developers is really why I stopped contributing at all. Getting a working tested patch submitted took me months of political effort, while "Team" members put in broken code (and apparently delete working code) without question, screaming "RERO" all the way.
As much as I've loved my time with this product, it's simply allowed the competition to close the gap. Kodi isn't that compelling anymore, and dealing with the new team leadership - even as an end user - has been awful.

One of the REASON'S I drag my feet for along time ! Before upgrading..... I never do until I start losing functions ! Or the new improvements out way the old...which rarely do.