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Android Zidoo X9S (X-series) 4K HDR / 3D / HD Audio / ZDMC (Kodi fork): Review & Use
the problem is visible with all UHD HDR movie, the problem is known for several months by Zidoo team and mirror know the problem for a long time too
Sony XBR65x930c, Onkyo tx-nr656, Focal Dome 7.1, Zidoo X20PRO, Egreat A11, Apple TV 4K/infuse PRO.
 
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(2018-06-05, 15:27)hdmkv Wrote: You mean display/projector info? If so, that’s irrelevant or won’t reveal anything about the banding issue. The signal/resolution is fine.

Banding occurs always with 4K and HDR movies; it’s just more pronounced/visible in scenes with skies... like within the first few minutes of ‘The Martian’ before the storm sequence, or the first few minutes of ‘The Revenant’ with DiCaprio’s wife and kid.
You also get color banding issues when bit depths are not tunneled thru from the source video via HDMI to the display properly.
An example is the AMLogic S905X / S905D devices that do 10bit > 8bit < 10bit transformations via Linux Kernel dithering and rounding.

If done properly like on the S905X Vero 4K you do not get major color banding issues.

So the question is - does the underlying Linux Kernel in the Zidoo's provide a proper 10bit tunnel or does it currently use buggy dithering and rounding to output color ?

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There are no 4:2:2 10bit 2160p support in the HDMI 2.0a standard, But some projectors that support this combination. That's why I want to know this information.
Also want confirm there are appropriate output 4:2:2 12bit.
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@mirror,

You talk about 4.2.2 12Bit, but it would be nice to solve the problem of 4.4.4 10Bit with all zidoo devices RTD 1295, and the new RTD1296 is worse.

For information, people sell their zidoo to buy beelink gt1 ultimate, apple tv 4k, etc...according to them, they have a better picture (no banding) with the UHD HDR videos files ...

i think that's quite sad, zidoo devices have many other qualities.

@hdmkv,

About your screenshot of the movie ''The martian'', did you use your X9S or your X20 ?

in my case,

with the X20 : i have banding with the 4.4.4 10Bit /12 Bit and HDMI range ''limited'', but if i choose HDMI range ''FULL'' the banding disappears but with 1080p the pictures is very dark.
(according to Sony ma tv x930C is compatible limited, that's why I use '' limited '' mode with all my devices)

with my X10 : i have banding with 4.4.4 10Bit and HDMI range ''limited'', but if i choose 12Bit/auto (HDMI range ''limited'') the banding disappears or i do not notice,  so since the Fw 1.4.12 I use with my X10 the 12bit / auto

see you

----------

eventually I think trying a GT1 ultimate/ LibreElec 8.2.4.1 or a 4K apple tv / infuse pro...
Sony XBR65x930c, Onkyo tx-nr656, Focal Dome 7.1, Zidoo X20PRO, Egreat A11, Apple TV 4K/infuse PRO.
 
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@hdmkv, interesting: [No banding on LG C8]
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@mirror88 are you sure that Zidoo X9S, X10 etc. actually outputs 12-bit  4:2:2? It looks like only 8-bit. I'm not talking about what I see on a AVR or HDMI analyzer. This is from a 4K waveform monitor. 12-bit 4:2:2 outputs of nVIDIA Shield and Minix U9-H (Android) are correct.
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(2018-06-06, 04:13)wrxtasy Wrote: An example is the AMLogic S905X / S905D devices that do 10bit > 8bit < 10bit transformations via Linux Kernel dithering and rounding.
If done properly like on the S905X Vero 4K you do not get major color banding issues.
There is no difference between Vero 4K and the LibreELEC nightlies on a cheap S905X. CoreELEC and community Amlogic LE have bad dithering. I am not sure whether there are 10-bit >8-bit>10-bit conversions in the newer or patched kernel for S905X devices. The output has 1-bit accuracy. It is hard to get that if there is 10-bit to 8-bit dithering.
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@OlivierQC, I've gone back to X9S with f/w v2.0.25 (vs. X20) for now. I won't make Zidoo happy with this, but so far, X20 to me is an oversized & heavy version of X9S/X10 with no added PQ/AQ benefits; maybe will change w/updates over time.

With X9S, I'm not seeing banding when I force 10-bit (vs. using Auto), but I get some dithering and wavy lines in the sky scenes in the opening of 'The Martian'. Also switched between limited & full HDMI range; seems to make no difference. If I use Auto or force 12-bit, Zidoo will play back in 4:4:4 and I not only get banding, but also sparklies in the picture. Could be my 35' HDMI cable, but it's supposed to be 18Gbps certified (and I never had issues w/it when I had Epson 5040UB, my previous PJ). I'll try reverting to f/w v1.4.12 & try the settings you're using.

The 4K HDR image is rock solid with 'The Martian' opening with nVidia Shield & Kodi 18 Alpha 1. My Optoma UHD51A PJ shows 8-bit 4:2:2 (which per @wesk05's replies in the Shield thread may be 10-bit incorrectly identified), but PJ's info also shows it's getting BT2020 & HDR is engaged.
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@hdmkv,

There is banding/dithering with the FW 1.4.12 and since that, i use YcBcR 4.4.4 AUTO/12Bit/limited with my X9S/10 and the PQ is good (no banding, etc...) with my X930C (10Bit panel), for now the X10 with the FW 2.0.25 is my favorite choice.

about the X20, I'm waiting for the next FW...

I'm not pulling the plug on Zidoo... but i bought an apple TV 4K and infuse PRO yesterday, it is a great little box.

And I will soon reconnect my shield TV, we'll see if Oreo brings something interesting with Auto Colorspace Switching / HDR, etc ...

See you
Sony XBR65x930c, Onkyo tx-nr656, Focal Dome 7.1, Zidoo X20PRO, Egreat A11, Apple TV 4K/infuse PRO.
 
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Not pulling plug on Zidoo either; they've been supporting X9S well since its 2016 release. With X20, from a hardware aspect, the build quality & dual HDD bays will appeal to some I expect, but I'll look forward to video improvements.

Considering Apple TV 4K, but lack of HD audio bitstreaming, especially for ATMOS & DTS:X, kinda kills it for me. Maybe tvOS 12 will bring bitstreaming or not (if ATMOS is only supported for premium streaming services). What does Infuse Pro add over MrMC?
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infuse pro is much more like ht 2.0 experience and does handle bdmv folder playback and possibly iso. I cannot recall the iso part. But 4K content in is raw form is infuse's forte. Its , by design a very dumbed down kiss interface for apple users.

I have 3 oleds, no projectors and am using the following combos

Shield for all HD content and streaming
Apple TV for DV streaming, airplay stuff. content ...patiently awaiting atmos or bitstream capabilities.
and Ziddo X9S for all 3D and 4K media.

The latest Zidoo firmware is very 10ft solidified in my opinion. If it were not for SMB shares sources dropping out sometimes and it auto cleaning library I might recommend it for my family to replace aging artic 10001 boxes...(@tom d520 I think) but it works for them as of now, and they have no interest in bitstreaming 3d or 4k. Another topic but I keep optimistic Zidoo will continue to improve upon HT 2.0. It's great to just click and play. and 3d or 4k just works as it should.
KODI1: Shield 2019 2D and 4K HDR / Zidoo Z9X 3DMVC /ATV4K 2D/ and 4K HDR/ DV AVR1: YAM RXA3080 DISP1: LG OLED77G6P /3D/HDR/DV
KODI2: Shield 2015 2D and 4K HDR / Zidoo X9S 3DMVC /ATV4K 2D and 4K/ HDR/ DV AVR2: Marantz NR1607 DISP2: LG OLED55C6P /3D/HDR/DV
KODI3: Shield 2015 2D and 4K HDR / Zidoo X9S 3DMVC /ATV4K 2D and 4K/ HDR/ DV AVR3: Denon AVR-X3300 DISP3: LG OLED65G6P /3D/HDR/DV
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(2018-06-08, 13:09)OlivierQC Wrote: There is banding/dithering with the FW 1.4.12 and since that, i use YcBcR 4.4.4 AUTO/12Bit/limited with my X9S/10 and the PQ is good (no banding, etc...) with my X930C (10Bit panel), for now the X10 with the FW 2.0.25 is my favorite choice.
I'm not seeing banding either w/limited, but as playback for 23.976 UHD is 12-bit 4:4:4, I get light (but annoying) sparklies in the picture. Will try a shorter 18Gbps 'certified' cable this weekend. For now, I prefer nVidia Shield & Kodi 18 Alpha for UHD playback.
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(2018-06-05, 15:27)hdmkv Wrote: You mean display/projector info? If so, that’s irrelevant or won’t reveal anything about the banding issue. The signal/resolution is fine.

Banding occurs always with 4K and HDR movies; it’s just more pronounced/visible in scenes with skies... like within the first few minutes of ‘The Martian’ before the storm sequence, or the first few minutes of ‘The Revenant’ with DiCaprio’s wife and kid.
 I just want to know how to display that kind of info on my TV, I'm not sure if my TV can handle HDR or not, the picture looks fine not dull or anything but there's no such info showing HDR
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What TV do you have? Most are able to show some level of info. on what they're receiving.
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Random question, probably straightforward but just want to check:

I've been looking at the zidoo from purely a kodi perspective however how does the device fair in terms of using it with its core software for just 3D MVC and 4K material if I didnt use kodi?

Are there any downsides and limitations in terms of performance that anyone can shed light on?

Thanks
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