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Cultural Imperialism
#46
I wasn't making a point about the quality or correctness. What I was trying to say is that it will be easier to juggle a dual identity when you can choose between two languages. For example: a French person could retain their roots and sense of belonging by speaking French to their parents, then moments later become a world citizen by switching to English with colleagues on the other side of the world.

If American, Australian, British, Canadian, Irish, New Zealand and Scots English are all supplanted by a globalised English then the native English speaker could lose that choice and that connection. With much of their identity becoming rootless. Some may welcome this vagabond existence, but I feel that most will feel they have lost more than they've gained. It's something that needs to be considered in the rush towards an ever more connected and integrated world.

Movies and Seasons are no longer American-English, they are the vocabulary of a Global English. I'm perfectly happy to use these terms when talking to people across the world, but in my home I'd prefer to use an English which connects me to family and friends and the place where I was born and raised.
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#47
I'm a tad older than you, so perhaps my fuddyduddiness is more ingrained, but I do understand your concern. I just wonder what's the best way to handle it... we're looking at "Proper British English" versus "vernacular British English" versus any other variation of the language. At that point, it's simply a translation, I think, although there's clearly a "who defines what's acceptable" angle, just as there is with any other language.
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#48
(2017-03-18, 00:33)Prof Yaffle Wrote: I'm a tad older than you, so perhaps my fuddyduddiness is more ingrained, but I do understand your concern. I just wonder what's the best way to handle it... we're looking at "Proper British English" versus "vernacular British English" versus any other variation of the language. At that point, it's simply a translation, I think, although there's clearly a "who defines what's acceptable" angle, just as there is with any other language.

It's difficult, isn't? How do you define "Proper British-English"? The freewheeling and laissez-faire nature of Anglo culture means we that don't have an equivalent of the Academie Francaise to oversee the use, vocabulary and grammar of the language. Aside from a few commonly agreed grammatical structures, English is as it is spoken and written. And with Movies becoming the predominant term how can you argue and conclude it isn't correct? At least not without some sort of vote or referendum.

And if we start talking about proper vs vernacular we also risk creating a situation like Norway's insolvable division of Bokmål and Nynorsk. And who would be the arbiter of these two or more distinct identities?

Perhaps the best (or least fractious) solution would be to provide a simple tool with which a Kodi user can easily tweak their language pack to suit.

Or maybe Team-Kodi could code an enormous switch that when flipped will provoke a national rebellion. Something where the populace will question and rebel against the inevitability of muesli becoming granola; flats becoming apartments; the privatiZation of the NHS; the market and shareholding replacing democracy and public ownership.
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#49
I feel a quote coming on
Quote: King Arthur: The Lady of the Lake, her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water, signifying by divine providence that I, Arthur, was to carry Excalibur. That is why I am your king.

Dennis: Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

Arthur: Be quiet!

Dennis: You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just 'cause some watery tart threw a sword at you!

Arthur: Shut up!

Dennis: I mean, if I went around saying I was an emperor just because some moistened bint had lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away!

Arthur: [grabs Dennis] Shut up! Will you shut up?!

Dennis: Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system!

Arthur: [shakes Dennis] Shut up!

Dennis: Oh! Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help, I'm being repressed!

Arthur: Bloody Peasant!

Dennis: Ooh, what a giveaway! Did you hear that? Did you hear that, eh? That's what I'm on about! Did you see him repressing me? You saw it, didn't you?
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#50
(2017-03-19, 02:46)nickr Wrote: I feel a quote coming on
Quote: King Arthur: The Lady of the Lake, her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water, signifying by divine providence that I, Arthur, was to carry Excalibur. That is why I am your king.

Dennis: Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

Arthur: Be quiet!

Dennis: You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just 'cause some watery tart threw a sword at you!

Arthur: Shut up!

Dennis: I mean, if I went around saying I was an emperor just because some moistened bint had lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away!

Arthur: [grabs Dennis] Shut up! Will you shut up?!

Dennis: Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system!

Arthur: [shakes Dennis] Shut up!

Dennis: Oh! Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help, I'm being repressed!

Arthur: Bloody Peasant!

Dennis: Ooh, what a giveaway! Did you hear that? Did you hear that, eh? That's what I'm on about! Did you see him repressing me? You saw it, didn't you?

I know I'm being a bit ridiculous: and potentially suffering from a massive sense of humour failure. And it's all a bit silly suggesting that one or two tweaks to a bit of media software matters much in the grand scheme. However, this culture and identity stuff really does matter.

Aside from the jokey headline, I've never suggested this was anything to do with repression. It’s far more to do with the real and profound impact of an apathetic resignation and the failure to deal with or even discuss the emergence of a new global identity and how it could work alongside existing cultural identities. That it doesn’t have to be a binary option. You can be both.

The apathy and failure is at the root of Britain's decision to divorce itself from a political union which has seen the longest period of peace in Europe's civilised history. It could also see the break-up of the UK itself. With all the problems that might create. Not least in Northern Ireland.

And then there's the cultural wars on the continent. With horrific expressions like the shootings in Paris.

Many also see it as the engine behind the rise of the Trump regime in the USA. Which few imagine will be for the best.

I know that a sub-section of a software forum isn't perhaps the best place to bang on about this culture stuff - I apologise for boring you all rigid - but if we can't even discuss something as simple as Movies vs Films without turning everything into a joke what hope do we have of dealing with the really big stuff?

And that really is my last splutter on the subject. Sorry for being a bit of an arse.
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#51
(2017-03-16, 14:34)Hidentity Wrote: Hello Everyone,

I wasn't sure if this should be posted in Feature Requests or here in Related Discussions, but I've opted for the latter because it felt like the kind of thing people might like to use as an excuse for a bit of a barney.

Would Team Kodi's language department consider offering a UK / Snob / Pedants' version of English?

Where Movies becomes Films, and Seasons becomes Series.

Also, might it be possible to offer the choice of exchanging Songs for Tracks? A song is piece of music with vocals. Most of my music is without.

I know this is more than a little pedantic, and next to the world of crap that's going on in Syria and the emerging crisis in Somalia it can't be said to matter in the slightest, but it still kind of grates. And it might not take that much time to tweak.

Thanks for your time.

Thomas - Life President of the Fuddyduddlian League


Some skins are providing this solution. I know it may not be much, but hey, it's still better than nothing.
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#52
OP your thread reminds me of the reaction I got when I mentioned taping a show off the telly. "What is taping?" they said.

If I was that type, I could say that there's no such thing as film any more... or fillum as one of the nuns at school would call them. Big Grin Could it be that the change in use of the term is to do with digital taking over, rather than a cultural thing?

(Isn't a series the show itself and a season one year of the series? So, you have the TV Series "Bergerac" and then season 1, season 2, etc for however long the show ran for?)
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#53
(2017-03-20, 13:24)bilgepump Wrote: OP your thread reminds me of the reaction I got when I mentioned taping a show off the telly. "What is taping?" they said.

If I was that type, I could say that there's no such thing as film any more... or fillum as one of the nuns at school would call them. Big Grin Could it be that the change in use of the term is to do with digital taking over, rather than a cultural thing?

(Isn't a series the show itself and a season one year of the series? So, you have the TV Series "Bergerac" and then season 1, season 2, etc for however long the show ran for?)

I promised myself I wouldn't keep coming back to this, but . . . .

If you take a look at the BBC iPlayer you will note that, for example, the TV Series The Last Kingdom is returning to our screens with the following introductory text: "Uhtred continues to play his part in the birth of a nation, as Series 2 begins." Also, the iPlayer lists Films as one of its categories. With no Movies to be seen.

You could also take a look at the Bergerac Box Set. With its product description that goes like this: "All nine series of the detective drama series starring John Nettles as unorthodox Jersey cop Detective Sergeant Jim Bergerac (John Nettles). Alcoholic and divorced father of a young daughter, Bergerac is a true maverick who prefers doing things his own way, and consequently doesn't always carry out his investigations the way his boss would like. "

There might be something in your question about the digital takeover. While I have lumped Movies, Seasons etc under the heading Global English, perhaps Internet English would be a more accurate term.
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#54
If this is that important, offer to join the translation team and put in the time and effort. Im sure if the translation work is done, the Kodi team wouldnt have too many issues adding it as long as enough people are on board with it. But it seems more that you are asking for someone else to put in the time and effort for you to do ALL the work. Dont take it rude or the wrong way, but I think the phrase is put up or shut up. If you want it badly enough, volunteer to do part of the work. Nobody is getting paid to create Kodi, so asking the team to do all the work (including translation for what breaks down to minor differences) for something a small subset of users want instead of doing what you can to help is asking a lot.
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#55
(2017-03-22, 18:17)thesuffering Wrote: If this is that important, offer to join the translation team and put in the time and effort. Im sure if the translation work is done, the Kodi team wouldnt have too many issues adding it as long as enough people are on board with it. But it seems more that you are asking for someone else to put in the time and effort for you to do ALL the work. Dont take it rude or the wrong way, but I think the phrase is put up or shut up. If you want it badly enough, volunteer to do part of the work. Nobody is getting paid to create Kodi, so asking the team to do all the work (including translation for what breaks down to minor differences) for something a small subset of users want instead of doing what you can to help is asking a lot.

The put up option could lead to a chaotic acrimony of competing 'Proper' English language packs. Each claiming to be the one true vocabulary.

However, rather than just slinking away, could I propose a third way? Could you tell me and others how and where to tweak the code ourselves? Teach a man to fish and all that.
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#56
Translation_System (wiki)
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#57
(2017-03-22, 15:13)Hidentity Wrote: this: "All nine series of the detective drama series
So they use it both ways.... As the whole show and as the yearly output of the show. Interesting.

(Why don't you just not sort your tv series into years, and view everything as "all seasons". Then you just get a long list and you won't have to think about how the group name is "incorrect"? Big Grin)
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#58
I actually generally agree with the series/season divide. The English being presented as default is really not "global" English. It's UK English, and should probably be listed as such, particularly given that there are other English options, like US English. Given that it's UK English, it probably should be called Series, rather than Season, unless my UK friends call the seasons of US shows "seasons" rather than "series." In which case, I'm afraid we're all totally screwed. Smile
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#59
Be afraid then...

US English is slowly overtaking and corrupting UK English in many areas, and this is one of them.
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#60
used to have my samba shares named as Films and TV Series, and Kodi would use those names for the actual entry in the file view. But they would show up in the home screen Kodi as Movies and TV Shows.. It was just unsatisfying in an asymmetrical kind of way. So after 10 years or so I finally caved. My shares are now named Movies and TV Shows.

I'm not even english, I just like to use english for all my programs. But in scandinavia a TV show is called TV-serie and movie is called film, so that's what I always felt was the most natural for me. But in the end I caved inSmile

IMO British English should default to TV Series and Films. Make it happenSmile
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