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4K HDR10 - State of Play thread - important media player limitations.
#31
Non compliant hardware, edited so this forum can stay clean
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#32
Hi, welcome...

Please take hardware that is NOT HDR capable out of this thread.

There are plenty of NUC threads - a whole heap of them in fact about such Intel hardware.
If you wish to discuss such a machine start a thread in the main Hardware section please.

This Kodi forum is also not a Plex discussion or support forum, please find the Plex support forum for that type of discussion.

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#33
I recently purchased a 4k HDR capable TV (LG OLED B7) on what seems to be the false assumption that playback of 4k 10 bit HDR files was 'easy'. Thinking of returning it.

I think I read the OP correctly, but just to be sure:

If I add a GTX 1030 2GB to my PC (i5-8600, 8GB RAM) it's *not* good enough for 4k HDR playback on Windows or Linux? I have no interest in Netflix as TV app is adequate.

If a GTX 1050 Ti 4GB is required, what's the best player config for windows:

  1. Kodi 17.x
  2. Kodi 18 alpha
  3. Kodi 17.x with dsplayer
  4. Kodi 17.x with dsplayer and madvr (only for HDR pass through)
  5. Other (Plex? - TV app plays HDR but no high def audio)

I normally use Linux, but it seems equally messy at the moment.

I need to bitstream audio and most or my material is <30Hz.

Is the cheapest option some S912 TV box with LE instead?

I'm seriously thinking of returning the TV unless the extra cost is < £100.

Thanks in advance.
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#34
Why would you blame the TV if it surely supports HDR, instead of the -possibly- badly configured HTPC?

Specially if your're using Linux, as there's still NO HDR support on this OS -if i'm up-to-date-.

On Win10, your two best options are DSPlayer+MadVR or MPCHC+MadVR at the moment. But again: these still would need a proper basic setting-up and a little bit more tweaking to adapt them to you'r videocard's power. 

Dunno' much regarding 1030's capabilities in practice, but I guess with very "standard" settings it should be juts fine for 4K / HDR playback, specially if you won't go over 30fps videos anyway. Mostly it's raw power could be the limiting factor, but this -I guess- only in the case if you also would want some MadVR extra settings turned on. 

If you would change the card anyway I would rather suggest to get an AMD RX card (RX 550 is the entry here), as it's much better for video playback in general (less Win10 issues and more point-perfect cadence playback). 

Mots people are satisfied with their Amlogic Boxes using LE or CE, but juts for recognition: S905X isn't outputing real 10bit only converted to 8bit (and then back to 10bit). And many some still complain regarding that the LE/CE on the S912 Boxes still isn't that much enhanced and having several deficiencies and issues with playback (these seems to be dependent on the video source as well).
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#35
I'm not blaming the TV, I'm blaming myself for not checking I had everything for full 4k HDR playback before investing heavily in a new TV. If I had known this before, I would've waited a year. The TV is superb but if I'm not going use the HDR features fully, I might as well stick to my old 4k non-HDR TV.

So I'm trying to think of ways of salvaging the situation. One option was to buy a GTX 1030, although it seems you're recommending the RX 550 as better minimum GPU. In which case anyone have first hand experience of HDR playback with Madvr, Win10 and a AMD RX 550 2GB? I'm only interested in HDR passthrough and not the fancy scaling (for now).

I'm sure confirmation or not of a GTX 1030 or RX 550 will help others who come to this thread for help.
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#36
In stead of using your PC as a mediaplayer you could use your PC as a mediaserver. Your TV has excellent apps available for playing 4k HDR content itself. If you use Plex you can use Xplay, or just the standard mediaplayer of your TV when using DLNA.
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#37
My current config is a Linux server with Plex and NFS shares. The client I use is a Wetek Play 2 (which appears not to support HDR but does support 4k).

I can use the TV apps to stream from my server but no HD Audio (DTS-HD or TrueHD) support (I have a amp and 5.1 speakers).

So my thinking was take my server and add a GPU to see if I can play the HDR material with bitstream HD audio to my amp instead.

Its the combination of 4k, HDR and HD audio I'm after.
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#38
(2018-07-06, 12:45)Mount81 Wrote: And many some still complain regarding that the LE/CE on the S912 Boxes still isn't that much enhanced and having several deficiencies and issues with playback (these seems to be dependent on the video source as well).
I'm now interested....
Please detail the "many" and provide examples of those having serious issues with LibreELEC ? Wink

Click HERE for some AMLogic S9xx testing done by @noggin.

CoreELEC is using Kodi Leia Alpha - by it's very Alpha nature it is still comparatively unstable Kodi software vs Krypton.

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#39
(2018-07-06, 15:57)wrxtasy Wrote:
(2018-07-06, 12:45)Mount81 Wrote: And many some still complain regarding that the LE/CE on the S912 Boxes still isn't that much enhanced and having several deficiencies and issues with playback (these seems to be dependent on the video source as well).
I'm now interested....
Please detail the "many" and provide examples of those having serious issues with LibreELEC ? Wink

Click HERE for some AMLogic S9xx testing done by @noggin.

CoreELEC is using Kodi Leia Alpha - by it's very Alpha nature it is still comparatively unstable Kodi software vs Krypton.   

Though I should add that since that testing it looks to have been established that the S905X doesn't have a clean 10-bit video playback path, and whilst it decodes 10-bit video and can be told to output 10-bit video, there is an 8-bit footprint that can only be masked by dither, not removed.

The S912 is the only current AMLogic platform with a clean, full 10-bit video path - and plays HDR10 stuff fine.

(I wish there was a stable Leia build for the S912 / Minix U9-H - as it would be great to test the BBC UHD iPlayer streams in it - but the Krypton builds don't seem to want to play ball? My guess is that the MPEG-DASH implementation in Krypton is older and doesn't have full support for live streams?)
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#40
(2018-07-06, 16:25)noggin Wrote: Though I should add that since that testing it looks to have been established that the S905X doesn't have a clean 10-bit video playback path, and whilst it decodes 10-bit video and can be told to output 10-bit video, there is an 8-bit footprint that can only be masked by dither, not removed. 
  
I don't think this applies to the kernel being used in Vero 4K (and ?CoreELEC builds). I did some testing with the 1LSB Quants2D test patterns (http://test.full.band/) and I got true 1LSB resolution. This is almost impossible without a true 10-bit video path.
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#41
My understanding is that CE has stopped using the OSMC kernel now.
CE targets other devices that we don't test on (i.e. non S905x). 

10-bit should be fine on Vero 4K, but it can require manually enabling currently. We are working on a more adaptive solution. 

Sam
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#42
(2018-07-06, 23:53)wesk05 Wrote:
(2018-07-06, 16:25)noggin Wrote: Though I should add that since that testing it looks to have been established that the S905X doesn't have a clean 10-bit video playback path, and whilst it decodes 10-bit video and can be told to output 10-bit video, there is an 8-bit footprint that can only be masked by dither, not removed. 
  
I don't think this applies to the kernel being used in Vero 4K (and ?CoreELEC builds). I did some testing with the 1LSB Quants2D test patterns (http://test.full.band/) and I got true 1LSB resolution. This is almost impossible without a true 10-bit video path.  
  
Really? That's great news. We just need someone to find out how to enable HLG flagging over HDMI and then we have a great iPlayer UHD HDR streaming solution Smile
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#43
I have a patch. 

There is some discussion on OSMC forums about iPlayer and 4K HLG streams. Getting iPlayer add-on to play those streams seems tricky; but when manually played back things worked as expected.

Sam

(edit: fix typo)
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#44
(2018-07-06, 15:57)wrxtasy Wrote:
(2018-07-06, 12:45)Mount81 Wrote: And many some still complain regarding that the LE/CE on the S912 Boxes still isn't that much enhanced and having several deficiencies and issues with playback (these seems to be dependent on the video source as well).
I'm now interested....
Please detail the "many" and provide examples of those having serious issues with LibreELEC ? Wink

Click HERE for some AMLogic S9xx testing done by @noggin.

CoreELEC is using Kodi Leia Alpha - by it's very Alpha nature it is still comparatively unstable Kodi software vs Krypton.   
 Based on recent user reports: kszaq LE 8.2.2.3: There's a main bug when subtitles appear on screen it would trigger a micro stutter in the video playback. Also just general complains regarding playback issues with different kind of video materials. 

wrxtasy LE 8.2.4.2: There's no auto freque switching in some cases at all, and have problem with the playback with lots of the the common test videos. +The subtitle stutter bug. 

And also generally, that the user experience and reliability is somewhat bellow of that what LE achieved on the S905X line. 

Don't misunderstand my skepticism here, and take as an assault against the S912 at all. I'm personally still also in the info collecting stage, but there are too many complains I've read so far, to not to take them acknowledged and under consideration towards the opposite opinions, like your's, that describe it like a mostly perfect solution and entirely neglects any mentions regarding the possible draw-backs...

An all-round description on what these users think in comparison is, if LE+S905X can be scored as 100%, than LE+S912 is rather somewhere 90%.
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#45
(2018-07-07, 02:07)Sam.Nazarko Wrote: I have a patch. 

There is some discussion on OSMC forums about iPlayer and 4K HLG streams. Getting iPlayer add-on to play those streams seems tricky; but when manually played back things worked as expected.

Sam

(edit: fix typo)
 Thanks Sam - will have a look.  Beta version of www iPlayer add-on works fine in Leia on nVidia Shield TV running Android and Apollo Lake running a recent Milhouse LibreElec build (via a DP1.2->HDMI 2.0 adaptor) though the latter is only 8-bit output depth and is doing a Rec 2020 -> Rec 709 conversion to output Rec 709 by the look of it.  Neither raise the HLG flag so I manually force my TV into HLG mode for the nVidia Shield TV.
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4K HDR10 - State of Play thread - important media player limitations.2.85