Alpha New TV Metadata site?
#1
Morning all,

Is there any interest in a new TV metadata and artwork site? I had a bit of time yesterday and mocked something up and was wondering if people need it?

I was spurred on by the downtime of TheTVDB yet again over this weekend.

If so, what would you like to see in a new site?
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#2
Some ideas from myself, basically trying to keep it simple and not just replicate TheTVDB.

- More artwork types
- More clearart
- Main page with latest artwork and activity
- Easy to use API
- Much more efficient API with no caching issues
- Single artwork for each show rather than multiple choices
- English only?
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#3
Also another question, what artwork types would you like to see?

EDIT with suggestions: 
- Poster (1000x1426)
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- 4 x fanart (1920x1080)
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- Character Poster
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- Character Art PNG (512x512)
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- Netflix style WideThumb (1000x562)
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- Netflix style Season WideThumb (1000x562)
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- HD ClearLogo (800x310)
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- ClearArt (1000x562)

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- Season Poster (1000x1426)
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- Show Banner (1000x185)
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- Season Banner (1000x185)

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#4
(2020-03-16, 11:46)docwra Wrote: - Single artwork for each show rather than multiple choices

I think this is the flaw in the current art graphics handling at the moment. Some shows have so many posters / art stuff linked, that it breaks Kodi's current database design. Of course, storing all these links in the database should not happen to begin with (IMHO). Only the active poster/banner/whatever should be memorized. More choices is always nice to have, if they can be handled properly.
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#5
I'm certainly not a fan of TV shows and I do not use TheTVDB, but there are several in the collection (The Expanse, Firefly, The Mandalorian ...) and for them I did all the artwork myself and store it locally. And then there is Fanart.tv, there are a lot of artwork on the series. From myself I can say what is missing there - Character Poster, Characterart PNG's
Do you want to create a new alternative site? If so, good luck, the more artworks, the better!
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#6
(2020-03-16, 16:07)Konon Wrote: Do you want to create a new alternative site? If so, good luck, the more artworks, the better!
Yes it will be alternative, but simpler (and more efficient) than TheTVDB while still allowing different types of modern artwork.
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#7
I suggest that you think very carefully before setting this up. The reason why I say this for, is unless you have very deep pockets the larger your site becomes the more you have to start paying, which is why a lot of sites ask for donations as you know.

If you are talking about a scraper system which potentially thousands will be using big bucks, can you afford to set it up?
Current FAVOURITE skin : Titan Bingie. I also love Artic Zephyr 2 and Aura
Movie Count : 14,615 TV Count : 33 (always changing as no dedicated TV show computer as yet) Music Count : Not used anymore
PC based 64 bit Windows 7 Kodi software 
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#8
(2020-03-16, 20:01)Video Titles Wrote: I suggest that you think very carefully before setting this up. The reason why I say this for, is unless you have very deep pockets the larger your site becomes the more you have to start paying, which is why a lot of sites ask for donations as you know.

If you are talking about a scraper system which potentially thousands will be using big bucks, can you afford to set it up?
Hehe, i'm well experienced in this and have a solid monthly Patreon income and server infrastructure from TheAudioDB/TheCocktailDB/TheSportsDB sites already I run that people have kindly supported over the years.

TheTVDB is clearly overloaded and TheMovieDB isn't expansive enough for TVShows yet. So i think I can offer an alternative (not a replacement, as both sites are great in different ways).

My idea is to design the site as efficient as possible and cut down on the translations and artwork served, so its lean while also allowing new cool artwork types that are popping up on the forum. A Modern simple API similar to the current ones I run would return 3 different sets of data. TVShow, Season and Episode all in a flat JSON structure with direct artwork links. Without any of the caching and API packing hacks TVDB needs to use. I'd also like to setup a watch list, so people can back up their show watched and personal ratings to the cloud. Thinking out loud that could be a nice premium feature, although the trakt plugin already does this for free Big Grin

I was actually around in the MeediOS days when its users setup the TV banner database, before it became TheTVDB so have history with all this. That was 15 ish years ago!
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#9
What i've come up with so far. Let me know what you think:

The last 2017 import of TheTVDB database site that they released publicly is imported, so lots of data.

No artwork yet other than the manually uploaded ones show in the mockup.

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#10
(2020-03-17, 14:34)docwra Wrote: What i've come up with so far. Let me know what you think:

The last 2017 import of TheTVDB database site that they released publicly is imported, so lots of data.

No artwork yet other than the manually uploaded ones show in the mockup.

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@docwra , I really like it, thanks! No need to replicate all of the data from other sites, just concentrate on the artwork. I will gladly support this, since I find it hard many times to get good artwork for tv shows, in particular for seasons.

Regards,

Bart
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#11
I don't see the point in another website. What's wrong with TMDB for data? The only things I see are that applications are still using TVDB and there are still more users adding data to TVDB than TMDB. Another website won't solve either problem, it will just fracture the user base even further.

Fanart.tv needs dev, design, and infrastructure help, then they might be able to expand to new artwork types and some other needed changes. For artwork otherwise, "Single artwork for each show rather than multiple choices" doesn't make much sense to me - it barely works for music, and TV shows generally have more options.
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#12
I am sorry to disagree with you Mr Rector, however I will explain for why.

If you have website 1 & 2 you might have a 50/50 split or a 60/40 70/30 etc

If one of those websites go down, say website 1 which has the lion share of the hits, then website 2 will have an increase in traffic, potentially more than it can afford to handle.

It then might be a situation where both websites then are out of order due to the extra and sudden traffic.

You say that fanart.tv needs infrastructure, then an overflow and a loss of user base will be better for them, than having too many users.

I mentioned to the OP that embarking on a project such as this is a fools folley, in respect that needs to have the funds there. The people behind Fanart went into something and if no one donated then it would have crashed and burned ages ago.

People should really not set up sites, expecting donations and for the end user to carry them really, thankfully people do, but others cannot afford to, so it would be beneficial for the main causes of the problem, such as Kodi and Mediaportal, Plex and Emby to come together and help these sites out, unless of course a program uses it's own resources.

Just my thoughts
Current FAVOURITE skin : Titan Bingie. I also love Artic Zephyr 2 and Aura
Movie Count : 14,615 TV Count : 33 (always changing as no dedicated TV show computer as yet) Music Count : Not used anymore
PC based 64 bit Windows 7 Kodi software 
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#13
Yes also bear in mind i'm pretty good at writing cross site importers now, so auto syncs with TMDB, TheTVDB and fanart.tv are possible. It could be done quite easily so there will be no division of resources, quite the opposite I hope.

My original motivation for this was TheTVDB having API issues again last weekend, it just hasn't been reliable for me and it was frustrating that I couldn't get the artwork I wanted in a simple way. 

When I started looking into TheTVDB database back end, it looked very inefficient to me in the way it serves data. I thought starting something from scratch could do better Wink

TheMovieDB is OK, but I personally prefer a much quicker interface to upload artwork.

Current progress:
- The site is basically done, all upload and edit feature are created for Show, Season, Episode and Actors.
- No login system yet
- Need to sort cloudflare and HTTPS certs
- No syncs with TheTVDB yet, this something I want to get working before release as the current data is 3 years old.
- You wont be able to create shows or edit show structures, all data is downstream of TheTVDB.
- API is done, keeping it simple flat JSON structure with full artwork URL links. Show, Actor search, then seasons and episode lists. Finally lookups via ID for each Show, Actor, Season and Episode. Very simple.
- A few new artwork types added such as actor render(Full body transparent) and actor cutout (transparent headshot)

Currently debating whether I should auto import from fanart.tv or let users upload their favourite artwork manually...
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#14
(2020-03-18, 23:03)docwra Wrote: TheMovieDB is OK, but I personally prefer a much quicker interface to upload artwork.

That can't be your only motivation for making a whole new website and API...

If you charge money (locking API access behind Patreon) for this like you did the rest, for what amounts to just "repackaging some other API", then we're gonna have big problems.
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#15
Hehe, well the history is that I wrote Movie-XML.com before TheMovieDB came along, the site is based on Movie-XML data originally that I passed on so hopefully you can see why I don't mind making new sites where I think things can be improved. Smile

TMDB is a great site (and only going to improve with the v5 frontend refresh coming). I'm a moderator over there and have been since day zero, it just serves a different purpose for me regarding TV Shows and particularity artwork.

Anyway enough background.. this is nearly done! API is laid out like this:

Progress update
- Very simple V1 API complete
- SSL cloudflare transfer done
- Edit screen for Show, Season, Episode, Actor overview text ONLY.

- All manual image uploads functions done
- New red design and icons complete
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