Android $30 Dynalink Android TV Box (Based on Google's ADT-3) at Wal-Mart
#16
(2020-11-19, 01:29)hdmkv Wrote: Sorry to hear, but not surprising unfortunately. For HDR/SDR, I assume there's no auto (or off) setting?

Unfortunately, no.........  The settings are quite sparse......
Reply
#17
I have to say that the Tivo 4k, in the $50 price range has a more mature firmware, but still can't use it on my primary TV, because of the lack of HDR to SDR settings.  I don't have the newest Chromecast to compare.
Reply
#18
(2020-11-19, 02:30)clarkss12 Wrote: I have to say that the Tivo 4k, in the $50 price range has a more mature firmware, but still can't use it on my primary TV, because of the lack of HDR to SDR settings.  I don't have the newest Chromecast to compare.

The CCGTV out of the box has HDR output issues as well until you dig into Android advanced display settings and Enable the confusingly titled “Match Content”. I’ve no idea why that setting is not Enabled by default.

Does Google seriously think users want ALL video content output as HDR, all the time by default ?
It seems they actually do - when you read the following help page:

https://support.google.com/chromecast/an...7046?hl=en

Seriously why is it so hard for these Android TV box vendors to even get basic things right or heaven help us do some pre-retail release device testing.

It’s pathetic really. Sad

Reply
#19
(2020-11-19, 05:35)wrxtasy Wrote: The CCGTV out of the box has HDR output issues as well until you dig into Android advanced display settings and Enable the confusingly titled “Match Content”. I’ve no idea why that setting is not Enabled by default.

I do. It's the same reason they run at a fixed resolution and frame rate. It's to avoid display re-syncs, flashes to black and OSDs flashing up on format changes. Some people will see this as annoying - and in some cases think their device is faulty as "the video output keeps breaking up".

It's the same reason most DVB set-top boxes that offer resolution switching usually come with the default of a fixed output resolution.
Quote:Does Google seriously think users want ALL video content output as HDR, all the time by default ?
It seems they actually do - when you read the following help page:

https://support.google.com/chromecast/an...7046?hl=en

I guess so - and if the content mapping is done properly it shouldn't cause too much of an issue for people who like to watch their content at the 'correct' settings. The issue is that most people want to watch SDR content far brighter than the HDR specs think SDR content should be viewed... (SDR peak white is 100nits in HDR10/Dolby Vision ST.2084 curves - but most people set their TVs a lot brighter than this for SDR. If the SDR->HDR conversion used by Google in their boxes doesn't perform a standard map, then all bets are off I guess. Mapping Rec 709 into Rec 2020 shouldn't be a huge issue, and shouldn't require tone mapping as the HDR Rec 2020 volume more than handles the entire Rec 709 SDR volume)
Quote:Seriously why is it so hard for these Android TV box vendors to even get basic things right or heaven help us do some pre-retail release device testing.

It’s pathetic really. Sad

I wouldn't put this in a 'getting it wrong' section - as they still offer the option. It's not like their non-existent support for resolution and frame rate switching in apps, where the OS appears to tell apps that it's in 1080p60 output mode even when it's in 1080p50...
Reply
#20
(2020-11-19, 10:36)noggin Wrote:
(2020-11-19, 05:35)wrxtasy Wrote: The CCGTV out of the box has HDR output issues as well until you dig into Android advanced display settings and Enable the confusingly titled “Match Content”. I’ve no idea why that setting is not Enabled by default.

I do. It's the same reason they run at a fixed resolution and frame rate. It's to avoid display re-syncs, flashes to black and OSDs flashing up on format changes. Some people will see this as annoying - and in some cases think their device is faulty as "the video output keeps breaking up".

Well such users are idiots then, surely you want to know you are getting what you payed for with Subscription streaming services.
ie. I paid extra $$$ for 4K HDR so I want to see an OSD Popup on my 4K HDR TV as confirmation.

Simply changing output from Rec.709 to BT.2020 should not cause issues on users 4K HDR TV's at all, it takes a miniscule amount of time.
Besides virtually all of these Dongles type devices are directly plugged into a TV, not running thru an AVR.

Quote:[Mapping Rec 709 into Rec 2020 shouldn't be a huge issue, and shouldn't require tone mapping as the HDR Rec 2020 volume more than handles the entire Rec 709 SDR volume]

It's all good in theory yes, but if my memory is correct - I seem to recall Nvidia trying to go down this pathway, a little while ago now. And there were all sorts of complaints and problems from Shield users when using various Brands of 4K HDR TV's.

Quote:The issue is that most people want to watch SDR content far brighter than the HDR specs think SDR content should be viewed...

Yes and for good reason if they predominantly watch SDR content during bright daylight hours.

Whatever happened to keeping it simple with Android ?
You compare this to Apple TV - set 1080p/4K SDR - switch on Dynamic Range Matching = done. Smile

The CoreELEC / OSMC devs, have no problems with auto switching Rec.709 <<-->> BT.2020 either, and ironically they use the same AMLogic Linux v4.9 based Kernel these problem Android TV devices also use.

The old adage "you get what you pay for" is very true. Wink

Reply
#21
(2020-11-19, 11:45)wrxtasy Wrote: Simply changing output from Rec.709 to BT.2020 should not cause issues on users 4K HDR TV's at all, it takes a miniscule amount of time.
It's not the Rec 2020<->Rec 709 switching that causes the issue, it's the SDR<->HDR EOTF switching (on some TVs that will kick in a whole new bunch of display settings, flash up an OSD, and in some cases cause a resync I believe)

Rec 709 / Rec 2020 switching within the same EOTF is less of an issue - but there's very little Rec 2020 SDR or Rec 709 HDR around (Some consumer and prosumer cameras let you shoot HDR Rec 709 in HLG mode though - so it is an option)
Quote:Besides virtually all of these Dongles type devices are directly plugged into a TV, not running thru an AVR.
Yep - that does reduce one source of 'flash bangs'.
Quote:
Quote:[Mapping Rec 709 into Rec 2020 shouldn't be a huge issue, and shouldn't require tone mapping as the HDR Rec 2020 volume more than handles the entire Rec 709 SDR volume]

It's all good in theory yes, but if my memory is correct - I seem to recall Nvidia trying to go down this pathway, a little while ago now. And there were all sorts of complaints and problems from Shield users when using various Brands of 4K HDR TV's.

That was the other issue. nVidia weren't outputting permanent HDR (that was Apple at one point with the ATV 4K), instead when you selected Rec 2020 as your output mode, they output Rec 709 SDR content mapped to Rec 2020 SDR with a BT.1886 EOTF flagged (which is the only real SDR EOTF defined, particularly for Rec 2020 content).

People were more used to watching the ill-defined 'Power Law Gamma' EOTF SDR (somewhere between 2.2 and 2.4 ISTR) for Rec 709 content - so didn't like the way their Rec 2020 BT.1886 conversion was mapped (particularly with some TVs not handling the BT.1886 EOTF properly either ISTR)

This wasn't an HDR / SDR thing, it was a Rec 2020 / Rec 709 thing ISTR. (Important to always separate gamut from EOTF in this stuff otherwise you get very confused)
Quote:
Quote:The issue is that most people want to watch SDR content far brighter than the HDR specs think SDR content should be viewed...

Yes and for good reason if they predominantly watch SDR content during bright daylight hours.

Whatever happened to keeping it simple with Android ?
You compare this to Apple TV - set 1080p/4K SDR - switch on Dynamic Range Matching = done. Smile

Doesn't Apple TV come with the same default as Google TV with Chromecast though? Unless you enable 'Match Dynamic Range' on the ATV 4K - all content is output in Rec 2020 HDR (with Rec 709 SDR stuff mapped into the Rec 2020 gamut and PQ ST.2084 EOTF - as used by HDR10 and DV)?

The Google TV with Chromecast offers the same option - and comes with the same default? Not sure your point?
Quote:The CoreELEC / OSMC devs, have no problems with auto switching Rec.709 <<-->> BT.2020 either, and ironically they use the same AMLogic Linux v4.9 based Kernel these problem Android TV devices also use.

The old adage "you get what you pay for" is very true. Wink

Yep - CoreElec, OSMC and LibreElec all offer Rec 709 / Rec 2020 and SDR / HDR10 / HDR HLG switching on compatible chipsets. They also offer SDR->HDR mapping on some (as nVidia and Google also offer?)

The fundamental limitation of the Google Chromecast with Google TV is the lack of resolution and frame rate switching - the EOTF and Gamut switching seems to be something that they have got almost right.
Reply
#22
(2020-11-19, 05:35)wrxtasy Wrote:
(2020-11-19, 02:30)clarkss12 Wrote: I have to say that the Tivo 4k, in the $50 price range has a more mature firmware, but still can't use it on my primary TV, because of the lack of HDR to SDR settings.  I don't have the newest Chromecast to compare.

The CCGTV out of the box has HDR output issues as well until you dig into Android advanced display settings and Enable the confusingly titled “Match Content”. I’ve no idea why that setting is not Enabled by default.

Does Google seriously think users want ALL video content output as HDR, all the time by default ?
It seems they actually do - when you read the following help page:

https://support.google.com/chromecast/an...7046?hl=en

Seriously why is it so hard for these Android TV box vendors to even get basic things right or heaven help us do some pre-retail release device testing.

It’s pathetic really. Sad

Even my cheapie Chinese boxes have the HDR to SDR settings..

This Dynalink is very sparse in it's settings.  It even has an "app" for the display settings, not under the settings menu as one would expect..... Weird.
Reply
#23
Does this box get updated by the OEM? Any kind of ROM support? Or does it just stick with the same firmware for good?
Reply
#24
Found this in the comments section of a youtube review of this box.


" I have one and I pulled the firmware apart. It's ATV8 and faked. It is also not certified and uses a fake Netflix cert from a Mibox chipset. Furthermore you can find the 'wallmart' version of the firmware on GitHub. I'm sure Walmart will soon take this off the shelf. "
Reply
#25
(2020-11-27, 15:31)ontap Wrote: Found this in the comments section of a youtube review of this box.


" I have one and I pulled the firmware apart. It's ATV8 and faked. It is also not certified and uses a fake Netflix cert from a Mibox chipset. Furthermore you can find the 'wallmart' version of the firmware on GitHub. I'm sure Walmart will soon take this off the shelf. "

I find that VERY hard to believe because it would be the first time in the 5 year history of Android TV that Chromecasting keys have been copied successfully.
The real test would be to see if Netflix can be Chromecast or not.

Reply
#26
[H]i-[d]eft [M]edia [K]een [V]ideosaurus
My Family Room Theater
Reply
#27
The Dynalink is washed out on my TV, and I also noticed that when watching youtube, the resolution isn't good. Youtube looks great through my Roku on the same TV.
Just confirming, the Tivo box has same washed out problem, but the newest Chromecast has a setting for non-HDR TV's to prevent the problem?

My Samsung KU6300 TV has some kind of half-implemented HDR support but I guess it can't read the HDR metadata that's being used.
Reply



Logout Mark Read Team Forum Stats Members Help
$30 Dynalink Android TV Box (Based on Google's ADT-3) at Wal-Mart0
This forum uses Lukasz Tkacz MyBB addons.