[Kode]

That wasn't the only reason it was denied, a bit of drop shadow on the logo and character would have got that passed. Occasionally images slip through the net, and we also have old logo's that were added before the moderation process was added (though that isn't the case in this particular one) and it can also happen when an image is approved by the person who uploaded them, so you can't always take a logo as gospel.

[gargoyle67]

[/url]

"Terra Nova - 164091

Details:
There seems to be a bit behind the 2 guys on the right head that needs cutting out. I think you missed that. You should try adding a glow or shadow too, it only needs to be small and subtle. I can offer you a few tips on that if you like."

Err no that's actually his backpack, Unless the mod means the little girls head in which case he's still wrong as it's the older girls shoulder.

[gargoyle67]

And heres another, And to my mind theres absolutely nothing wrong with the image:
Details:
A very small outer-glow is needed, just to take the edge off it. The cut-out is nice and tight though. Just add a small glow. Message me if you want any help or filters or further advice. Nice job otherwise."


Since when has outer glow been mandatory ? It's alway been optional. And I think after 150 odd clearart posts I know how to add an outerglow, I stopped using it way back because it looks lame, ppl were over doing it and it looked like the clearart had a personal force field Fine deny the image if its too jagged but not if it doesn't have the outerglow filter That's pretty lame.

Edit**
From Fanart TV Tutorial page:"3.This is optional, but nice – select outer glow layer style with opacity around 26ish, just to have image pop a little on a black background"

[Kode]

[/url]

"Terra Nova - 164091

Details:
There seems to be a bit behind the 2 guys on the right head that needs cutting out. I think you missed that. You should try adding a glow or shadow too, it only needs to be small and subtle. I can offer you a few tips on that if you like."

Err no that's actually his backpack, Unless the mod means the little girls head in which case he's still wrong as it's the older girls shoulder.

It looks like you have squished them?

[Kode]

And heres another, And to my mind theres absolutely nothing wrong with the image:
Details:
A very small outer-glow is needed, just to take the edge off it. The cut-out is nice and tight though. Just add a small glow. Message me if you want any help or filters or further advice. Nice job otherwise."


Since when has outer glow been mandatory ? It's alway been optional. And I think after 150 odd clearart posts I know how to add an outerglow, I stopped using it way back because it looks lame, ppl were over doing it and it looked like the clearart had a personal force field Fine deny the image if its too jagged but not if it doesn't have the outerglow filter That's pretty lame.

Edit**
From Fanart TV Tutorial page:"3.This is optional, but nice – select outer glow layer style with opacity around 26ish, just to have image pop a little on a black background"

There's no need to get so defensive, the mod was just trying to help you get the image to look as good as possible.

Generally a drop shadow or outer glow can help smooth out the edges, but you are right, it is optional.

*edit* also, if you have an issue with an image being denied, speak to them on the site, either with the chat function or the forum, not all of the mods use these forums.

[gargoyle67]

Not getting defensive just pointing out how random the modding appears to be, The image is not squashed as you can clearly see with heads in the pic (I always use the shift key when resizing which keep the resizing proportional) That's not the reason it was denied either, Also you can't post images on the Fanart TV site to highlight my points on these images.
There really is no reason why both of the images should have been denied. Needless to say I won't be changing them either just because a mod likes drop shadows and or outer glow filters.

[Kode]

Not getting defensive just pointing out how random the modding appears to be, The image is not squashed as you can clearly see with heads in the pic (I always use the shift key when resizing which keep the resizing proportional) That's not the reason it was denied either, Also you can't post images on the Fanart TV site to highlight my points on these images.
There really is no reason why both of the images should have been denied. Needless to say I won't be changing them either just because a mod likes drop shadows and or outer glow filters.

ok this is going off topic now, but looking at the faces you can clearly see it HAS been squashed... you seriously can't see that? You have both images right there one under the other? I just pasted the original over your clearart and resized it, and it's not even close, you must have accidentally released the shift key at some point, using ctrl+t I can tell you that your height is about 83% of what it should be.

The rules need more clearly defining, but they aren't currently, so I agree sometimes the moderation is a bit patchy, but I don't blame the mods for this at all, they are doing a hard, thankless job, no-one has offered to mod, no-one has offered to help out with the site in any way (project co-ordinator / developer / designer), no-one really pipes up except to complain, so until those things change you are just going to have to deal with the fact the mods are doing the best they can under difficult circumstances.

[gargoyle67]

The picture I posted was to show that there wasn't any bits of background I missed and had been resized from the original one I cut the clearart from, So you really can't use that as an overlay. Your not going to match up something that's taken from an 4642x3095 and resized to 1024x768 for posting on the forum. But apples and oranges, Still not the reason it was denied.

While I appreciate mods don't get paid and little thanks for doing the modding, Neither do the ppl like me that contribute to the site, Most of the clearart I submit I do multiple versions, Not for myself as I'll only use one for myself, The others I do are for the community to give them a wider choice. Like I said, I don't mind if I get images denied for a valid reason but I'm simply not going to add things for the mods that suddenly develop an art critic's eye, Sorry. I don't want to sound confrontational it's just how I feel.

[Kode]

The problem is, I have never been a mod myself, I created the site as a resource to the early clearlogo pioneers, in it's early stages things weren't clearly nailed down, and it has grown, we have early images that moderators themselves contributed, that those same moderators now wouldn't approve (some of hikaricores early ones for example).

The "rules" were just thrown together with no real thought behind them, and no real discussion (should images have drop shadows, shouldn't they, should there be a maximum drop shadow size, should we have a gutter (like we have with characterart), what constitutes an acceptable image).

In the early days this didn't really matter because the pioneers like mcborzu and hikaricore, who really drove the clearlogo wagon, we around to decide these things.

Neither of these two really actively contribute anymore (not having a go, it's just the way it is), they have moved on to other things, and I sometimes feel like I have been left holding someone elses baby, not really sure what to do with it.

The same goes with the other images types and sections, I didn't create these types, I just created a repository for them, so I don't really feel like I can dictate anything with them, and any new images (like clearlogos/clearart for movies) would probably need to follow the old ones for consitency.

The other problem is the sheer number of clearlogos, there are now over 5,000 so it's a little hard to change any rules now.

We get through mods at a pretty alarming rate, do you know how mods are currently added?

I ask the person who is most active and who has had most of their images approved by a previous mod who has just left.

hikaricore used to deal with all the mod stuff because he was the best at it, knew what the mods were supposed to be looking for, could pick out good mods and take them to task when they weren't doing their jobs properly.

So anyway, the point of all this is, don't whinge about the mods, if you don't like the way something is being handled, then get involved, message me and say "I want to help out with the site, I'd like to help come up with clear guidelines for moderating, I'd like to help make decisions with the direction the site is going, I'd like to help with decisions on new image types".

If on the other hand, that isn't something you want to do, your options are to continue submitting images, if you don't like the decision a mod makes SPEAK WITH THEM DIRECTLY THROUGH THE CHAT FUNCTION as that was one of the reasons for adding it. Or don't contribute images, which would be a shame, because we really do appreciate good contributions.

Making a fuss about it on the xbmc forums, just pisses people off and is counter productive to what I assume your intentions are.

So, don't take any of this the wrong way, I WELCOME anybodys input, in fact i would SERIOUSLY APPRECIATE it, I need help, the new site is a massive job and i'm relying on the few mods I have 100% to take the load off me having to try to moderate images, just do it in the correct place and to the correct people.

[gargoyle67]

Ok Kode thanks for your in depth explanation, And I would certainly help in anyway I can as I think it's a great repository for xbmc art, Again I only posted on here as I'm pretty sure your forum doesn't allow pics to be posted so I could highlight the areas in question.
What got my backup was being denied for something that I shouldn't have I suppose :o as I do try to abide by forum\site rules

[Kode]

Yeah, I can understand where you are coming from, I think part of the problem stems from there being no way to thank a user, so the only time people hear off the mods is when something is denied.

I think in this case the mod was trying to help you get the best possible image (rightfully or wrongfully) rather than rejecting your image for not being good enough.

I think the wording of the email is also possibly wrong, image denied sounds so harsh.

If you really are interested in helping out then feel free to pm me with your IM details (gtalk or msn) and we can have a chat, there are lots of non technical things that need doing (tutorials, help files, project co-ordination, outreach/promotion, newsletters, moderation, template creation, documentation, etc) so if any of that interests you (or anyone else) I would love to hear off you.

[jacktyler]

Hello Gargoyle,

I've only just read your posts, otherwise I would have chipped in sooner. I was the Mod who denied the two Terra Nova cleararts you're pictured here.

On the first example you have, I would like to hold my hands up and say I made a mistake, when I said, "There seems to be a bit behind the 2 guys on the right head that needs cutting out. I think you missed that."
I can now see that it's the backpack and it looks so obvious now, I can't believe I didn't recognize it first time round! However, I did say "seems to be" and "think you missed that" because I wasn't 100% sure at the time. And I did offer to give you any advice if you wanted it.

We all make mistakes and that was a rather silly (but innocent) mistake by me, so I apologize. However, I do spend quite a lot of time looking at every individual image in detail and testing them, because I firmly believe that contributors such as yourself, deserve that, and deserve constructive feedback.

Regarding the clearart that was denied because of the logo (one you'd used from Fanart.tv) - I'm not sure if that was me or not who denied it, but I wouldn't get too worried about that. It has happened to me also, on plenty of occasions. I once had a clearart accepted, only to have it denied again 3 days later because there was a spelling mistake in the logo! I'd just used the logo from fanart.tv and naturally assumed that because it had already been accepted, it must be fine to use it! Lesson learned for me, so unfortunately, it's not necessarily safe to just use the logo from the site, you need to check it. As Kode said, sometimes things slip through the net.

On the second Terra Nova image you've used here as an example, I think your own words are worth picking up on: "And to my mind theres absolutely nothing wrong with the image"
Ultimately, you can set as many rules or guidelines for mods as you like, but when it comes to the crunch, the modding process is still very subjective. We're not computers, but people making judgement calls and we don't always get it right. But I hope that I'm always constructive when I deny an image and try to give proper feedback and suggestions. When I look at an image, I'm always thinking in the back of my mind, "How could this be improved?" So I stand by my denial of that particular image.

As I said in both those denials, you are welcome to contact me on site any time you like, either by the chat window, or by making a post in the TV forums section. I'm perfectly happy to take a second-look at an image if you think I was wrong to deny it and happy to change my mind, if you can convince me I should. I'm quite approachable

I hope I've tried to explain my position reasonably. Best wishes, and I would like to thank you for your contributions and the time and effort you take, it is very much appreciated, even if it doesn't always feel that way.

Jack

[IlhanK]

Is this site down?

[karandras24]

Is this site down?

Not for me, but it is pretty slow.

[Kode]

seems to be back now, apparently someone was ddosing the server