[oldtvwatcher]

Either I missed this or you edited your post and added it, but either way...

However everyone seems to believe only the good side of him, which sort of always turns us into the bad guys. Especially since he was kicked off the team, he seems to have been either helping users or on this pet project of turning as many people as he can against 'team kodi', who you might realise are actually the people writing most of the code and improvements you request.

Honestly at this point, if the people on "Team Kodi" are such jerks then I would rather they never write another line of code and just quit than to keep poisoning the well for everyone not of their narrow mindset. You seem to think that because they write code they should be given a pass for awful behavior. I would very much disagree with that sentiment. They are not the only coders in the world.

To put this a little more in perspective, I was one of the people who mediated in the conflict that got him kicked out. I advocated on his behalf with the team as well as spend several hours with him calmly explaining why he really could not stay anymore.

How on earth do you consider that advocating on his behalf? It sounds like you kicked him under the bus!

[phate89]

+1

Unfortunately this is not the first time something like this has happened:

https://www.reddit.com/r/kodi/comments/4...oid_dev_a/

https://www.reddit.com/r/kodi/comments/3...rs_of_the/

And since I'm posting Reddit links, I notice this issue is being discussed there, and some of the comments are enlightening. I find it interesting that there is more discussion of this problem there than in this forum:

https://www.reddit.com/r/kodi/comments/5...to_be_fun/

I am sad to say that IMHO it's high time the Kodi project was forked. That's the only thing that will save it from the toxic developers and moderators that are flushing the whole project down the toilet.

Did you miss that those 2 threads are both from the same person that was actually kicked from the team and it's still one of the people that enters in every dispute in the forums?
It's true that there were some communication problems in both sides in this problem but please stop quoting someone that this morning took wiki hostage kicking out from official wiki team members and adding a user as admin after the team left him that access giving him some trust he simply didn't deserve--

[natethomas]

The reason you see his writings as "spreading hate" is is because you are part of the problem. You guys that are behind all this rottenness stick together and reinforce your own beliefs that you are the good guys, but you are not. And you have turned on the few really good guys on your team.

The point is you guys have a serious problem in your core team and instead of trying to get to the root of it and expunge it, you instead resort to personal attacks against your critics. Instead of cutting out the cancer, you are giving it a place to thrive. And like any cancer, eventually it's going to kill your project.

I'm giving a 3 day cool down for this. Calling the entire current team the bad guys and a place where cancer grows is frankly a bit off the far end of our civil conduct rules. Maybe we are all super evil types, but I have to think there are calmer, more rational ways of making that argument.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to go polish my horns.

[Pasado]

Interesting, the first post you link is posted by an ex team member who is spreading a lot of hate everywhere he can.
He was kicked out of the team for misusing his power, editing other peoples posts and generally liking to fan up any conflict he can see.
He posts it on reddit using the npicture of another team member, and goes on to name several team members by their real names.

Half the information there is not as the Android developer in question would describe it himself.

The second post is the same person pretending to be a fucking angel.

Understand who your source of information is - he happens to be firmly implanted in the current conflict and has not helped it one bit .
Actually it probably deteriorated a lot because of his involvement.

I suspect him to be firmly bipolar and he does seem to show two sides, one where he is a great and calm guy who helps people and literally made our wiki great.
Sadly his other side is not so much fun, choosing a side in any argument he sees and then becoming this raging asshole who works towards increasing the argument rather then calming it down.

However everyone seems to believe only the good side of him, which sort of always turns us into the bad guys. Especially since he was kicked off the team, he seems to have been either helping users or on this pet project of turning as many people as he can against 'team kodi', who you might realise are actually the people writing most of the code and improvements you request.

To put this a little more in perspective, I was one of the people who mediated in the conflict that got him kicked out. I advocated on his behalf with the team as well as spend several hours with him calmly explaining why he really could not stay anymore. Not even two weeks later he goes into a complete rampage.

If this is what Team Kodi calls a statement then it breaks the Official:Forum rules (wiki) not only do you use foul language but you accuse someone of having a mental illness, as a bipolar sufferer myself I find it highly offensive that you would use this illness in your rant above. And people wonder why there is still a big stigma concerning mental health sufferers, shame on you!

[Kib]

Oh my. I don't think I have ever seen ányone get Nate angry.

[Kib]

If this is what Team Kodi calls a statement then it breaks the Official:Forum rules (wiki) not only do you use foul language but you accuse someone of having a mental illness, as a bipolar sufferer myself I find it highly offensive that you would use this illness in your rant above. And people wonder why there is still a big stigma concerning mental health sufferers, shame on you!

It really was not a rant and I do not accuse him of having a mental illness - I truly, honestly believe he is bipolar, mainly because he reminds me a lot of a very good friend who has borderline personality disorder - which as you might very well know shares many character traits. I'm sorry if I offended you - especially since you seem to be a very inoffensive person yourself.

I put a lot of trust in Ned last year. I advocated he should not be completely kicked from the team, but keep his access to the wiki on which he does great work.
yesterday he completely abused that trust and that power which really hurt me on a personal level. Today I see someone who is extremely impolite himself use the posts made by Ned as an example.

[natethomas]

Honestly, it didn't get me angry. I actually laughed a little when I got to the cancerous growth bit. I don't love doling out bans, but dang, that guy needed to calm down.

Also, kib's post was not an official statement. I believe whenever it does come out, it'll probably come from one of our newly minted mods from a few weeks ago.

[Kib]

Yeah I didn't want to write the official post, because me trying to mediate the issue put me too much in the center of it already.

[da-anda]

As we have a couple new team members (long term forum moderators) that got a little insight in team discussions etc but are not yet "corrupted", maybe they would like to share their view on what was going on, and why Team Kodi is all bad or maybe not.

To everyone interested - please believe me when I say that we do what we do because we care about the project and believe that this or that is the way forward and in the best interest of the average user, even though it will not please everyone. Having to do certain decisions is really NO fun for us, but we still bite the bullet because we belive it's the best for the project.
I can't give any qualified comment on this current drama, as I didn't follow it, but as a less vocal team member (as it has been mentioned a couple posts earlier) I simply trust the decisions of the team members that for years maintain our repositories and in my eyes always did a good job. Like most of the team, I have no idea about our repos, all the rules etc, so I'm not in a position to judge. But how I know ronie and martijn, they for sure had reasons to do what they did.
As with every dispute, things likely could have be handled better/different on both sides, but we can't go back and fix it, so all we can do is look forward and learn from it.

I'd like to thank robwebset for all the time he donated to the project by writing and supporting his add-ons and am sad that he had to take that decision. But I really understand it. I myself was about to quit because to many things where going on in my private live along with an earlier mentioned drama within the team and thus working on Kodi just wasn't fun anymore. But instead of quitting I took a couple weeks off from anything Kodi (besides using it ofc) and after a while I missed it, and the fun working on it was back. I hope that robwebset will once also find the fun again.

[Ned Scott]

I think that blind trust needs to be re-evaluated, da-anda. You're a good and honest person, and it saddens me to see you defend petty decisions made by others.

I think 99% of the time, ronie makes the right call and does vital work for the project. I think he is more vital to the project, and more honest, than most. However, he is not infallible. He should not be kicked out or stoned to death over this, but he just needs someone to recenter himself on that last 1%.

A true friend is someone who will tell the other when they are wrong, instead of just always agreeing with them.

[knives of ice]

the thing that makes ZERO sense is why all of rob's support threads with hundreds of posts are moved to the garbage section and closed? why did they have to be closed if they were moved to garbage? now, to get support we have to PM him for answers? move them to garbage and leave them open if you must move them to garbage. no idea how doing this helps people trying to get questions answered.

[natethomas]

the thing that makes ZERO sense is why all of rob's support threads with hundreds of posts are moved to the garbage section and closed? why did they have to be closed if they were moved to garbage? now, to get support we have to PM him for answers? move them to garbage and leave them open if you must move them to garbage. no idea how doing this helps people trying to get questions answered.

All threads moved to the garbage are automatically closed by the forum software.

[Ned Scott]

I suspect him to be firmly bipolar and he does seem to show two sides, one where he is a great and calm guy who helps people and literally made our wiki great.

Holy shitsnacks, did you just call me bipolar? What is wrong with you?


Less and less people believe you about this "abuse of power" thing when I've always been open about my own mistakes. I've never tried to hide anything, and I let people come to their own conclusions. I'm not a saint, and truth be told, I'm an asshole, but what I've done is nothing compared to what is going on now.

I'm still an asshole, I still added "vote Trump" (as a joke, no one with a brain actually votes for Trump for anything) to poll about dropping android support completely. I think I once unbanned someone that ronie banned (but thanks for assuming the other time was intentional as well, when I also undid my own bans by mistake) when I first became a team member (he'll never forgive that one, it seems). I still threw the team under the bus over the logo, hijacked facebook and google+ to post that you guys were ignoring community input on it. I still flew off the handle and said mean and hurtful things to people when I got mad. I made a lot of situations worse when I should have kept my stupid mouth shut. I've been petty, spiteful, and mean. I'm not a good person.

But the picture you try to paint of me here is the biggest load of horse shit I've seen. You're not interested in facts or what actually happened. You just want to discredit me, by any means necessary. That's pretty low.


(EDIT: oh wait, I changed the poll later from "vote Trump" to say "this is silly", because I didn't think the joke had reached international level yet. Such abuse of power, though.)

[Karnagious]

no idea how doing this helps people trying to get questions answered.

I dont think that is their concern.

Which is concerning to many other people.

[hiehot]

3 days for cancer mathaphore, nothing for unjustifiend accusation of mental illness. Sound like team kodi allright. I really hope that some one forks this project before these *self cencored* kill the whole project.

Is is really sad to see something so great like kodi killed by couple of hypocrite, power hungry indivituals.
You should really grow up and take responsibility for your actions.

There really should be open and clear statement from the team about what has happened and why. It's the only thing that could mend things. For some reason I don't have high hopes that this will ever happen. They really don't have a good track record handling these kind of things in the past.