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Intel Apollo Lake
#31
What is going on?
I read that kaby Lake and Apollo Lake won't support HDMI 2.0 on other sites it saids it does...
What is it now?
Hevc, 10bit, hdr, rec2020, but no hdmi 2.0? WTF?
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#32
Anadtech don't even mentioned hdmi 2.0, hdr, rec2020.

They only said apollo lake still not supporting hvec 10 bit
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#33
From this article at Anandtech: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10610/inte...-january/3

"The Video Quality Engine also receives some tweaks for HDR and Wide Color Gamut (Rec.2020) support. Skylake's VQE brought in RAW image processing support with a 16-bit image pipeline for selected filters. While Intel has not discussed the exact updates that enable Rec.2020 support, we suspect that more components in the VQE can now handle higher bit-widths. Intel pointed out that the HDR capabilities involve usage of both the VQE and the EUs in the GPU. So, there is still scope for further hardware acceleration and lower power consumption in this particular use-case.

Intel claims that Kaby Lake-U/Y can handle up to eight 4Kp30 AVC and HEVC decodes simultaneously. HEVC decode support is rated at 4Kp60 up to 120 Mbps (especially helpful for premium content playback and Ultra HD Blu-ray). With Kaby Lake-U/Y's process improvements, even the 4.5W TDP Y-series processors can handle real-time HEVC 4Kp30 encode."

"One of the disappointing aspects from Skylake that has still not been addressed in Kaby Lake-U/Y is the absence of a native HDMI 2.0 port with HDCP 2.2 support. Intel has been advocating the addition of an LSPCon (Level Shifter - Protocol Converter) in the DP 1.2 path. This approach has been used in multiple motherboards and even SFF PCs like the Intel Skull Canyon NUC (NUC6i7KYK) and the ASRock Beebox-S series. Hopefully, future iterations of Kaby Lake (such as the desktop and high-performance mobile parts coming in January) address this issue to simplify BOM cost for system vendors.

In summary, Kaby Lake-U/Y resolves one of the major complaints we had about Skylake's media engine: the absence of hardware-accelerated 4Kp60 HEVC Main10 decode. There are a few other improvements under the hood that enable a more satisfying multimedia experience for consumers. The software and content-delivery ecosystems have plenty of catching up to do when it comes to taking full advantage of Kaby Lake-U/Y's media capabilities."

If that applies for Kaby Lake you know that it will be the same for Apollo Lake. So it does get HDR and REC.2020. But it will not be delivered via native HDMI 2.x. They have to use a seperate chip like in the NUC6i7KYK. That means that for linux systems they have to implement this in the i915 driver for the kernel to be able to get HDR or any other "fancy" features. At this point this seems to be something they might get into the 4.9 or 5.0 kernel it seems. But time will tell...
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#34
I was planning to use it with Windows.
I hope they get it right with this workaround. DP to HDMI.
Thanks for the information.
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#35
(2016-09-02, 21:39)_Spook_ Wrote: From this article at Anandtech: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10610/inte...-january/3

"The Video Quality Engine also receives some tweaks for HDR and Wide Color Gamut (Rec.2020) support. Skylake's VQE brought in RAW image processing support with a 16-bit image pipeline for selected filters. While Intel has not discussed the exact updates that enable Rec.2020 support, we suspect that more components in the VQE can now handle higher bit-widths. Intel pointed out that the HDR capabilities involve usage of both the VQE and the EUs in the GPU. So, there is still scope for further hardware acceleration and lower power consumption in this particular use-case.

Intel claims that Kaby Lake-U/Y can handle up to eight 4Kp30 AVC and HEVC decodes simultaneously. HEVC decode support is rated at 4Kp60 up to 120 Mbps (especially helpful for premium content playback and Ultra HD Blu-ray). With Kaby Lake-U/Y's process improvements, even the 4.5W TDP Y-series processors can handle real-time HEVC 4Kp30 encode."

"One of the disappointing aspects from Skylake that has still not been addressed in Kaby Lake-U/Y is the absence of a native HDMI 2.0 port with HDCP 2.2 support. Intel has been advocating the addition of an LSPCon (Level Shifter - Protocol Converter) in the DP 1.2 path. This approach has been used in multiple motherboards and even SFF PCs like the Intel Skull Canyon NUC (NUC6i7KYK) and the ASRock Beebox-S series. Hopefully, future iterations of Kaby Lake (such as the desktop and high-performance mobile parts coming in January) address this issue to simplify BOM cost for system vendors.

In summary, Kaby Lake-U/Y resolves one of the major complaints we had about Skylake's media engine: the absence of hardware-accelerated 4Kp60 HEVC Main10 decode. There are a few other improvements under the hood that enable a more satisfying multimedia experience for consumers. The software and content-delivery ecosystems have plenty of catching up to do when it comes to taking full advantage of Kaby Lake-U/Y's media capabilities."

If that applies for Kaby Lake you know that it will be the same for Apollo Lake. So it does get HDR and REC.2020. But it will not be delivered via native HDMI 2.x. They have to use a seperate chip like in the NUC6i7KYK. That means that for linux systems they have to implement this in the i915 driver for the kernel to be able to get HDR or any other "fancy" features. At this point this seems to be something they might get into the 4.9 or 5.0 kernel it seems. But time will tell...

Kaby Lake has an updated video engine. Apollo lake don't have the same gpu. Both are gen9, but only kaby lake has those new features
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#36
(2016-09-04, 14:10)agiler Wrote:
(2016-09-02, 21:39)_Spook_ Wrote: From this article at Anandtech: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10610/inte...-january/3

"The Video Quality Engine also receives some tweaks for HDR and Wide Color Gamut (Rec.2020) support. Skylake's VQE brought in RAW image processing support with a 16-bit image pipeline for selected filters. While Intel has not discussed the exact updates that enable Rec.2020 support, we suspect that more components in the VQE can now handle higher bit-widths. Intel pointed out that the HDR capabilities involve usage of both the VQE and the EUs in the GPU. So, there is still scope for further hardware acceleration and lower power consumption in this particular use-case.

Intel claims that Kaby Lake-U/Y can handle up to eight 4Kp30 AVC and HEVC decodes simultaneously. HEVC decode support is rated at 4Kp60 up to 120 Mbps (especially helpful for premium content playback and Ultra HD Blu-ray). With Kaby Lake-U/Y's process improvements, even the 4.5W TDP Y-series processors can handle real-time HEVC 4Kp30 encode."

"One of the disappointing aspects from Skylake that has still not been addressed in Kaby Lake-U/Y is the absence of a native HDMI 2.0 port with HDCP 2.2 support. Intel has been advocating the addition of an LSPCon (Level Shifter - Protocol Converter) in the DP 1.2 path. This approach has been used in multiple motherboards and even SFF PCs like the Intel Skull Canyon NUC (NUC6i7KYK) and the ASRock Beebox-S series. Hopefully, future iterations of Kaby Lake (such as the desktop and high-performance mobile parts coming in January) address this issue to simplify BOM cost for system vendors.

In summary, Kaby Lake-U/Y resolves one of the major complaints we had about Skylake's media engine: the absence of hardware-accelerated 4Kp60 HEVC Main10 decode. There are a few other improvements under the hood that enable a more satisfying multimedia experience for consumers. The software and content-delivery ecosystems have plenty of catching up to do when it comes to taking full advantage of Kaby Lake-U/Y's media capabilities."

If that applies for Kaby Lake you know that it will be the same for Apollo Lake. So it does get HDR and REC.2020. But it will not be delivered via native HDMI 2.x. They have to use a seperate chip like in the NUC6i7KYK. That means that for linux systems they have to implement this in the i915 driver for the kernel to be able to get HDR or any other "fancy" features. At this point this seems to be something they might get into the 4.9 or 5.0 kernel it seems. But time will tell...

Kaby Lake has an updated video engine. Apollo lake don't have the same gpu. Both are gen9, but only kaby lake has those new features
No. If you look at the second table here:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10635/inte...o-lake-soc

You see that Apollo Lake also has an updated video engine. It does not have HEVC Main10, but it does have HEVC.
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#37
(2016-09-04, 22:10)_Spook_ Wrote: You see that Apollo Lake also has an updated video engine. It does not have HEVC Main10, but it does have HEVC.

For many people Main 10 HEVC is the issue. Now that UHD/4K broadcasts are happening, and some are using 10 bit, not having 10 bit HEVC decode is an issue. (My S905 Wetek Hub plays 2160/59.94p HEVC 8 and 10 bit stuff fine over HDMI 2.0 - though it may only be outputting 8 bit)
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#38
@__SPook_

Don't talk what the news writes, without verifying, here is the output of a BXT with current vaapi drivers: http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=...pid2408646
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No Debug Log no issue.
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#39
Wink 
Yeah, here are some good hardware news.
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#40
Well, not everyone has Intel insiders they can call when in doubt @fritsch

I don't really care that much about Apollo Lake. I want Kaby Lake. But the no native HDMI 2.x was a bad move. Oh well...no perfect hardware or software.
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#41
I'm pretty disappointed with the new Apollo Lake decoding support. I was waiting since the beginning of the year for it to launch.
Full HEVC decoding on an 4.5W 150$ NUC would have been perfect.
Unfortunately I've run out of patience with Intel and decided to go with the Nvidia Shield console.
While not perfect by any means, is more future proof in terms of video decoding than any low powered offerings from the pc side.
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#42
So is there going to be any low powered Kaby Lake systems released this year? I have been waiting since the beginning of the year to upgrade my main HTPC. Originally Kaby Lake was supposed to be out by summer. I would get one of the ARM system's but I need to be able to split the audio/video because my receiver only support 1080p and I still want to be able to receive HD audio.
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#43
I'm seeing reports of Q1 2017 now for "high performance" or "desktop" configurations of Kaby Lake. The mobile Y and U series are supposed to be out now or soon I'm guessing.

Have always found Intel's CPU naming schemes rather confusing.
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#44
(2016-09-12, 18:19)hdmkv Wrote: I'm seeing reports of Q1 2017 now for "high performance" or "desktop" configurations of Kaby Lake. The mobile Y and U series are supposed to be out now or soon I'm guessing.

Have always found Intel's CPU naming schemes rather confusing.

I hope that is the case because my current aging HTPC is starting to become unstable, so I do need to replace it soon.
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#45
(2016-09-12, 13:06)razvanmg Wrote: I'm pretty disappointed with the new Apollo Lake decoding support. I was waiting since the beginning of the year for it to launch.
Full HEVC decoding on an 4.5W 150$ NUC would have been perfect.
Unfortunately I've run out of patience with Intel and decided to go with the Nvidia Shield console.
While not perfect by any means, is more future proof in terms of video decoding than any low powered offerings from the pc side.

What is missing exactly ?
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Intel Apollo Lake4.569