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stoolzo · 2017-03-17, 01:39

nothing is going wonky here, this is all expected behavior using 444 full RGB, this is the only way to get BTB WTW, you cannot get it any other way using an ATI card with crimson drivers. Sure I could simply revert to limted 420 and everything would look ok and work as expected, if I had an LED TV i'd do that but mine is an LG OLED, I wont bore you with the details of why full RGB BTB/WTW is superior on OLED.

i'm not losing FULL RGB at any point, all my BTW/WTW clipping patterns show expected values in all my media players as I have my colour space set correctly.

just to reiterate, nothing looks wrong on My HTPC, my setup may look a little complicated but I can assue you its correct, done frankly stupid about of tested and research on this which started here:

http://kodi.wiki/view/Video_levels_and_color_space

I am however open to be convinced otherwise, if someone can show me a less complex way of getting BTB/WTW on my card i'll gladly swap.

.

stoolzo · 2017-03-17, 01:57

(2017-03-15, 13:43)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:06)stoolzo Wrote: I have two problems with 4k playback, sometimes it crashes but the main problem is MADVR display modes. If I add 2160p display modes to MADVR it totally messes up KODI for me, its always done this, in every version including the Jarvis versions. With these set, when I play a 1080p movie it either plays it in a little box in the top right hand side of screen, or its massively zoomed and I only see the top right hand side of the picture.

I havent been able to resolve this issue within dropping in and out of windowed mode, this resets it but it just breaks again.

I've tried everything to resolve this, fresh installs of KODI and GFX drivers galore, the only think I havent done is rebuild my OS.

I know some people use MadVR's switching function. However, for me, I disable that in Madvr, and let Kodi change the resolution, and I set Kodi to use FullScreen window, with my resolution set at 2160p. Plays all content (640, 720,1080, 4k etc) at 2160, at 24p, 50p, and 60p no problem. In MadvR im using dx11, and full screen exclusive mode.

K

out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

spencerjford · 2017-03-17, 03:31

(2017-03-17, 01:57)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:43)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:06)stoolzo Wrote: I have two problems with 4k playback, sometimes it crashes but the main problem is MADVR display modes. If I add 2160p display modes to MADVR it totally messes up KODI for me, its always done this, in every version including the Jarvis versions. With these set, when I play a 1080p movie it either plays it in a little box in the top right hand side of screen, or its massively zoomed and I only see the top right hand side of the picture.

I havent been able to resolve this issue within dropping in and out of windowed mode, this resets it but it just breaks again.

I've tried everything to resolve this, fresh installs of KODI and GFX drivers galore, the only think I havent done is rebuild my OS.

I know some people use MadVR's switching function. However, for me, I disable that in Madvr, and let Kodi change the resolution, and I set Kodi to use FullScreen window, with my resolution set at 2160p. Plays all content (640, 720,1080, 4k etc) at 2160, at 24p, 50p, and 60p no problem. In MadvR im using dx11, and full screen exclusive mode.

K

out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

LG 4k tv, (though not OLED)

Radeon rx480 and Windows 10.

And no, you are are wrong. Setting limited on anything automatically loses BTB and WTW, because that's what it is supposed to do. Limited drops any and all BTB and WTW information being sent or received by a display. If full RGB is being sent to a display and it expects LIMITED you get the crushed blacks. And that's proper behavior. What you think you are seeing with BTB and WTW is actually not being seen. It's impossible.

oldpainless · (This post was last modified: 2017-03-17, 14:38 by oldpainless.)

(2017-03-17, 01:57)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:43)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:06)stoolzo Wrote: I have two problems with 4k playback, sometimes it crashes but the main problem is MADVR display modes. If I add 2160p display modes to MADVR it totally messes up KODI for me, its always done this, in every version including the Jarvis versions. With these set, when I play a 1080p movie it either plays it in a little box in the top right hand side of screen, or its massively zoomed and I only see the top right hand side of the picture.

I havent been able to resolve this issue within dropping in and out of windowed mode, this resets it but it just breaks again.

I've tried everything to resolve this, fresh installs of KODI and GFX drivers galore, the only think I havent done is rebuild my OS.

I know some people use MadVR's switching function. However, for me, I disable that in Madvr, and let Kodi change the resolution, and I set Kodi to use FullScreen window, with my resolution set at 2160p. Plays all content (640, 720,1080, 4k etc) at 2160, at 24p, 50p, and 60p no problem. In MadvR im using dx11, and full screen exclusive mode.

K

out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

gtx 980 ti strix, Win 8.1 x64, 4k Samsumg 55 inch HDR set. All set at 0-255 RGB (apart from Lav set at leave untouched) 12 bit 23/24 p 2160p out (50/60 Hz 8bit). And, as I said, I leave all switching to Kodi (2160p 23/24/50/60 etc etc).

K

stoolzo · (This post was last modified: 2017-03-17, 16:44 by stoolzo.)

(2017-03-17, 03:31)spencerjford Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 01:57)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:43)oldpainless Wrote: I know some people use MadVR's switching function. However, for me, I disable that in Madvr, and let Kodi change the resolution, and I set Kodi to use FullScreen window, with my resolution set at 2160p. Plays all content (640, 720,1080, 4k etc) at 2160, at 24p, 50p, and 60p no problem. In MadvR im using dx11, and full screen exclusive mode.

K

out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

LG 4k tv, (though not OLED)

Radeon rx480 and Windows 10.

And no, you are are wrong. Setting limited on anything automatically loses BTB and WTW, because that's what it is supposed to do. Limited drops any and all BTB and WTW information being sent or received by a display. If full RGB is being sent to a display and it expects LIMITED you get the crushed blacks. And that's proper behavior. What you think you are seeing with BTB and WTW is actually not being seen. It's impossible.

Nope, i'm definately getting BTW and WTW, if you think you are correct perhaps you can explain how option (F) below achieves BTB / WTW, i've taken this direct from the KODI WIKI, you'll have to excuse me if I take their word over yours.

http://kodi.wiki/view/Video_levels_and_color_space

2.2 Summary of Results
A) Full, Full, Full -- Video Level CORRECT : WtW & BtW Clipped, Single scaling
B) Full, Full, Limited -- Video Level WRONG : Crushed Blacks
C) Full, Limited, Full -- Video Level WRONG : Washed Out Colors
D) Full, Limited, Limited -- Video Level CORRECT : WtW & BtW Clipped, Double scaling
E) Limited, Full, Full -- Video Level WRONG : Washed Out Colors
F) Limited, Full, Limited -- Video Level CORRECT : WtW & BtB preserved, Zero scaling
G) Limited, Limited, Full -- Video Level WRONG : Extreme Washed Out Colors
H) Limited, Limited, Limited -- Video Level WRONG : Washed Out Colors

The reason why mine works is that its set to (F) above:

LIMITED = KODI set to 16-235 "ON"
FULL = GPU set to FULL RGB
LIMTED = TV set to "LOW" which is limted.

stoolzo · 2017-03-17, 16:36

(2017-03-17, 12:11)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 01:57)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 13:43)oldpainless Wrote: I know some people use MadVR's switching function. However, for me, I disable that in Madvr, and let Kodi change the resolution, and I set Kodi to use FullScreen window, with my resolution set at 2160p. Plays all content (640, 720,1080, 4k etc) at 2160, at 24p, 50p, and 60p no problem. In MadvR im using dx11, and full screen exclusive mode.

K

out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

gtx 980 ti strix, Win 8.1 x64, 4k Samsumg 55 inch HDR set. All set at 0-255 RGB (apart from Lav set at leave untouched) 12 bit 23/24 p 2160p out (50/60 Hz 8bit). And, as I said, I leave all switching to Kodi (2160p 23/24/50/60 etc etc).

K

What is your desktop pixel set to, 4:4:4 FULL RGB or something else?

Also, you do know the the 980 isnt a full 4k Card, it compressed the output to 10gb so you might not be able to get HDR working.

oldpainless · (This post was last modified: 2017-03-17, 17:40 by oldpainless.)

(2017-03-17, 16:36)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 12:11)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 01:57)stoolzo Wrote: out of interest, what GPU and windows build are you using, is yours a 4K htpc or 1080p?

gtx 980 ti strix, Win 8.1 x64, 4k Samsumg 55 inch HDR set. All set at 0-255 RGB (apart from Lav set at leave untouched) 12 bit 23/24 p 2160p out (50/60 Hz 8bit). And, as I said, I leave all switching to Kodi (2160p 23/24/50/60 etc etc).

K

What is your desktop pixel set to, 4:4:4 FULL RGB or something else?

Also, you do know the the 980 isnt a full 4k Card, it compressed the output to 10gb so you might not be able to get HDR working.

RGB, as recommenced for use with MadVR, and as mentione dabove, 0-255, so yes, Full at 12 and 8 bit.

The 980TI is more than capable of NGU Sharp Very High Luma for scaling all conent to 2160p, and it handles HDR fine:

https://developer.nvidia.com/getting-know-new-hdr
https://developer.nvidia.com/high-dynami...evelopment - the SDK demo flips my set into HDR mode.

K

stoolzo · 2017-03-17, 17:39

(2017-03-17, 17:24)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 16:36)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 12:11)oldpainless Wrote: gtx 980 ti strix, Win 8.1 x64, 4k Samsumg 55 inch HDR set. All set at 0-255 RGB (apart from Lav set at leave untouched) 12 bit 23/24 p 2160p out (50/60 Hz 8bit). And, as I said, I leave all switching to Kodi (2160p 23/24/50/60 etc etc).

K

What is your desktop pixel set to, 4:4:4 FULL RGB or something else?

Also, you do know the the 980 isnt a full 4k Card, it compressed the output to 10gb so you might not be able to get HDR working.

RGB, as recommenced for use with MadVR, and as mentione dabove, 0-255, so yes, Full at 12 and 8 bit.

The 980TI is more than capable of NGU Sharp Very High Luma for scaling all conent to 2160p, and it handles HDR fine:

https://developer.nvidia.com/getting-know-new-hdr
https://developer.nvidia.com/high-dynami...evelopment - the SDK demo flips my set into HDR mode just fine.

K

yes it works but the card only has 10gbps output so something is getting compressed somewhere as you need a minimum throughput of 18gbps to get FULL RGB 4K Deep colour @ 60hz.?

oldpainless · 2017-03-17, 20:50

(2017-03-17, 17:39)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 17:24)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 16:36)stoolzo Wrote: What is your desktop pixel set to, 4:4:4 FULL RGB or something else?

Also, you do know the the 980 isnt a full 4k Card, it compressed the output to 10gb so you might not be able to get HDR working.

RGB, as recommenced for use with MadVR, and as mentione dabove, 0-255, so yes, Full at 12 and 8 bit.

The 980TI is more than capable of NGU Sharp Very High Luma for scaling all conent to 2160p, and it handles HDR fine:

https://developer.nvidia.com/getting-know-new-hdr
https://developer.nvidia.com/high-dynami...evelopment - the SDK demo flips my set into HDR mode just fine.

K

yes it works but the card only has 10gbps output so something is getting compressed somewhere as you need a minimum throughput of 18gbps to get FULL RGB 4K Deep colour @ 60hz.?

I'm sure you are right, anyways, back to on-topic.

K

stoolzo · 2017-03-18, 01:00

(2017-03-17, 20:50)oldpainless Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 17:39)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-17, 17:24)oldpainless Wrote: RGB, as recommenced for use with MadVR, and as mentione dabove, 0-255, so yes, Full at 12 and 8 bit.

The 980TI is more than capable of NGU Sharp Very High Luma for scaling all conent to 2160p, and it handles HDR fine:

https://developer.nvidia.com/getting-know-new-hdr
https://developer.nvidia.com/high-dynami...evelopment - the SDK demo flips my set into HDR mode just fine.

K

yes it works but the card only has 10gbps output so something is getting compressed somewhere as you need a minimum throughput of 18gbps to get FULL RGB 4K Deep colour @ 60hz.?

I'm sure you are right, anyways, back to on-topic.

K

do you have kodi set to 2160p, is it upscaling everything to 4k?

stoolzo · 2017-03-18, 01:45

(2017-03-15, 23:47)stoolzo Wrote: ok managed to get this stable but i've had to scrap 1080p playback completely, KODI just isnt stable with a mixture of resolutions configured accross kodi, the PC and MADVR, I suspect there are priorities fighing against each other here which is making it crash or just not work properly. No amount of fiddling gets everything workking, here is my most stable setup.

Set KODI to 2160p
Take 1080p modes out of MADVR, just use 2160p modes.
Exclusive mode needs to be turned on for 3D MVC to work, especially if you are using an external player.
3D MVC will only work in 1080p mode so as i am forcing coding and MADVR to output only in 2160p 3D MVC doesnt work properly, it either double upscales or crashes, the work around here is to setup external filters in MPC-HC and use this as an external player, if you set this to open in full screen this works fine.

Rest if my PC settings if anyone is interested / has a AMD gpu using the crappy crimson drivers.

1. use radeon mod to force 16-235
2. Set FULL RGB 4:4:4 pixel format
3. Set TV to: LOW / HDMI LOW whatever your TV calls (16-235)
4. These settings will crush your desktop and youtube, there is no way around this if you want to get BTB / WTW, my work around is a bit of software call gamma panel where you can setup presets to dail the brightness up when watching youtube videos etc.
6. KODI 16-235 ON
7. MADVR set to 16-235

-----------------------------------

AMD users, latest crimson drives fixes both H264 corruption and colour space issues, dynamic range is now set correctly and so radeon mod is no longer required to get BTW WTW

apgood · 2017-03-18, 15:59

(2017-03-18, 01:45)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 23:47)stoolzo Wrote: ok managed to get this stable but i've had to scrap 1080p playback completely, KODI just isnt stable with a mixture of resolutions configured accross kodi, the PC and MADVR, I suspect there are priorities fighing against each other here which is making it crash or just not work properly. No amount of fiddling gets everything workking, here is my most stable setup.

Set KODI to 2160p
Take 1080p modes out of MADVR, just use 2160p modes.
Exclusive mode needs to be turned on for 3D MVC to work, especially if you are using an external player.
3D MVC will only work in 1080p mode so as i am forcing coding and MADVR to output only in 2160p 3D MVC doesnt work properly, it either double upscales or crashes, the work around here is to setup external filters in MPC-HC and use this as an external player, if you set this to open in full screen this works fine.

Rest if my PC settings if anyone is interested / has a AMD gpu using the crappy crimson drivers.

1. use radeon mod to force 16-235
2. Set FULL RGB 4:4:4 pixel format
3. Set TV to: LOW / HDMI LOW whatever your TV calls (16-235)
4. These settings will crush your desktop and youtube, there is no way around this if you want to get BTB / WTW, my work around is a bit of software call gamma panel where you can setup presets to dail the brightness up when watching youtube videos etc.
6. KODI 16-235 ON
7. MADVR set to 16-235

-----------------------------------

AMD users, latest crimson drives fixes both H264 corruption and colour space issues, dynamic range is now set correctly and so radeon mod is no longer required to get BTW WTW

By latest version of crimson drivers, which version do you mean? Might be useful in case a newer version breaks it again.

Cynwrig · 2017-03-19, 03:38

When I use mpc-hc I got no stutter at all, but when I use my same settings with dsplayer it can't handle it. Lots of stutter, only smooth 3 seconds after pauzing then it runs slow again. Can someone give me advice please... I can't believe the gui is this performance heavy so it's probably something else.

Thanks in advance.

stoolzo · 2017-03-19, 05:10

(2017-03-18, 15:59)apgood Wrote:
(2017-03-18, 01:45)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-15, 23:47)stoolzo Wrote: ok managed to get this stable but i've had to scrap 1080p playback completely, KODI just isnt stable with a mixture of resolutions configured accross kodi, the PC and MADVR, I suspect there are priorities fighing against each other here which is making it crash or just not work properly. No amount of fiddling gets everything workking, here is my most stable setup.

Set KODI to 2160p
Take 1080p modes out of MADVR, just use 2160p modes.
Exclusive mode needs to be turned on for 3D MVC to work, especially if you are using an external player.
3D MVC will only work in 1080p mode so as i am forcing coding and MADVR to output only in 2160p 3D MVC doesnt work properly, it either double upscales or crashes, the work around here is to setup external filters in MPC-HC and use this as an external player, if you set this to open in full screen this works fine.

Rest if my PC settings if anyone is interested / has a AMD gpu using the crappy crimson drivers.

1. use radeon mod to force 16-235
2. Set FULL RGB 4:4:4 pixel format
3. Set TV to: LOW / HDMI LOW whatever your TV calls (16-235)
4. These settings will crush your desktop and youtube, there is no way around this if you want to get BTB / WTW, my work around is a bit of software call gamma panel where you can setup presets to dail the brightness up when watching youtube videos etc.
6. KODI 16-235 ON
7. MADVR set to 16-235

-----------------------------------

AMD users, latest crimson drives fixes both H264 corruption and colour space issues, dynamic range is now set correctly and so radeon mod is no longer required to get BTW WTW
By latest version of crimson drivers, which version do you mean? Might be useful in case a newer version breaks it again.

17.3.2

apgood · 2017-03-19, 17:58

(2017-03-19, 05:10)stoolzo Wrote:
(2017-03-18, 15:59)apgood Wrote:
(2017-03-18, 01:45)stoolzo Wrote: AMD users, latest crimson drives fixes both H264 corruption and colour space issues, dynamic range is now set correctly and so radeon mod is no longer required to get BTW WTW
By latest version of crimson drivers, which version do you mean? Might be useful in case a newer version breaks it again.

17.3.2

Cool thanks