"Place Shifting" add player + transcode streaming to web server interface & JSON API?
#1
Lightbulb 
I currently use ORB to stream from my home server to my locations when i travel for work. It works pretty well except when the orb servers decide to act up and/or the orb software on my server decides it wants to rescan all my content at the same time and bogs down my system like nothing else....
Was looking into other options and was wondering if there was something else out there or if someone was working on a way to have xbmc on my windows server able to compress data on-the-fly and send it via HTTP or another protocol to a client xbmc, which then can decompress the stream.. i understand it would have to be a lossy compression, and the quality would suffer, but currently it is the same with orb...

With the use of Hamachi VPN, i can access and stream via SMB from my windows server to my client location, no matter where i am... but this is limited to music at best.. video is impossible on-the-fly streaming with no compression... it is simply to much data trying to be sent via the vpn that isnt being sent/received fast enough that the buffer has no chance... But if xbmc could compress on-the-fly, it might be possible..
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#2
You would need some sort of transcoding tool. There are many that do this already. TVersity is one that comes to mind, it may have an option that XBMC can use or with a plugin.

You would need a fast computer to encode video on the fly though.

Here is a link to another thread that may help

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid...t=TVersity
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#3
Allen626 Wrote:You would need some sort of transcoding tool. There are many that do this already. TVersity is one that comes to mind, it may have an option that XBMC can use or with a plugin.

You would need a fast computer to encode video on the fly though.

Here is a link to another thread that may help

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid...t=TVersity


I haven't mentioned reencoding the video at all... Talking about Lossy compression based on connection speeds... Basically the same thing ORB does... Orb has a direct stream option where you stream from your server to your client directly (usually done through http) or you can have the stream relayed on the orb network (server uploads stream data to the orb server, orb server relays the stream to your client computer)...
Basically trying to do the same thing, but over SMB instead of HTTP (or whatever they use for the orb server relay).. Since all my video files in xbmc are pathed via SMB with my server's name as the path instead of its ip assigned by my router, i can browse and sort and even scan for library updates even when i am not in my own network via Hamachi VPN...
The only problem with this is, the Hamachi VPN connection isn't fast enough (or rather the network i am currently on the net with isn't fast enough) to support direct uncompressed streaming... Orb fixes this by determining your connection speed to the internet (upload and download) and doing the same on your server and using the slowest speed to compress the file appropriately so it can maintain a steady stream for the network speed.. This is done Lossy I believe, so you get lower resolution on the client side...
My suggestion is a way to implement a compression into xbmc to do the same thing...
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#4
Numus Wrote:I haven't mentioned reencoding the video at all... Talking about Lossy compression based on connection speeds... Basically the same thing ORB does... Orb has a direct stream option where you stream from your server to your client directly (usually done through http) or you can have the stream relayed on the orb network (server uploads stream data to the orb server, orb server relays the stream to your client computer)...
Basically trying to do the same thing, but over SMB instead of HTTP (or whatever they use for the orb server relay).. Since all my video files in xbmc are pathed via SMB with my server's name as the path instead of its ip assigned by my router, i can browse and sort and even scan for library updates even when i am not in my own network via Hamachi VPN...
The only problem with this is, the Hamachi VPN connection isn't fast enough (or rather the network i am currently on the net with isn't fast enough) to support direct uncompressed streaming... Orb fixes this by determining your connection speed to the internet (upload and download) and doing the same on your server and using the slowest speed to compress the file appropriately so it can maintain a steady stream for the network speed.. This is done Lossy I believe, so you get lower resolution on the client side...
My suggestion is a way to implement a compression into xbmc to do the same thing...

Lossy compression means it is transcoding the data. I am not familiar with ORB but TVersity can do lossy conversion to flv or other formats for your library.
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#5
Allen626 Wrote:Lossy compression means it is transcoding the data. I am not familiar with ORB but TVersity can do lossy conversion to flv or other formats for your library.

http://all-streaming-media.com/articles/...ession.htm
I wouldn't call it transcoding because you aren't changing the format of the file (xvid to mpeg-2, or flacc to mp3)

Since the format remains the same after the stream is decompressed... It would be transcoding if the end format was different then the original (lets see for the application of streaming to a mobile that doesn't support specific formats and codec)
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#6
ORB most certainly transcodes. It's lossy because the content is reencoded (transcoded, same shit) at a lower bitrate. Start and end codec or container mean nothing. There's no way you're going to magically make media smaller without doing this. Take a look at rar/zip/bz2/7z compression, some of the best available, when applied to audio and video you get ~5% MAX filesize reduction, and the CPU overhead is appalling for a media application.
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#7
althekiller Wrote:ORB most certainly transcodes. It's lossy because the content is reencoded (transcoded, same shit) at a lower bitrate. Start and end codec or container mean nothing. There's no way you're going to magically make media smaller without doing this. Take a look at rar/zip/bz2/7z compression, some of the best available, when applied to audio and video you get ~5% MAX filesize reduction, and the CPU overhead is appalling for a media application.

I thought what orb does is called Transrating....
Ahh shit... http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7571246.html
guess who owns the patent....
Guess this wont happen after-all...

Looks like orb might be in a little trouble also...
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#8
Doesnt VLC have that built in?
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#9
Soju Wrote:Doesnt VLC have that built in?

Kinda.. it is a stream to vlc client only and doesnt have the organizational skills that xbmc is amazing for... technically if this was in xbmc and you used portforwarded instead of vpn (would be a bigger pain for paths) you could theoretically take an xbox xbmc to anyones tv and plug it into the net and tv and stream videos from your home server to their tv...
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#10
Numus Wrote:I thought what orb does is called Transrating....
Ahh shit... http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7571246.html
guess who owns the patent....
Guess this wont happen after-all...

Looks like orb might be in a little trouble also...

Patents only disallow people from making money out of an idea if not making a deal for reimbursement of the patent holder. Even thought there is a patent you are still free to implement it for your own use since your not making a profit out it. I don't really see why free software couldn't implement such features. But then again, Ubuntu etc would have to be careful of what they bundle.

BTW, Tvheadend, through it's HTS protocol, has this capability of transrating from what I understand. Then again, it is free software.
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#11
well the good news is i found a way to connect ORB to xbmc via Upnp over VPN and it lists it out as a folder structure, so it does pretty much what i want it to do.. except i am unwilling to scan it into the library because it would duplicate the stuff i already have in there (one as smb and one as upnp)...

Only strange thing is i am not sure how it is pulling the content.. Since i didnt specify which of the 2 users i want to use (each user has different video folders they can access)...
Basically orb has the feature of directstream over upnp... i am guessing this still uses Transrating.. will test it while i am away on work next week to see the limitations..
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#12
Numus Wrote:well the good news is i found a way to connect ORB to xbmc via Upnp over VPN and it lists it out as a folder structure, so it does pretty much what i want it to do.. except i am unwilling to scan it into the library because it would duplicate the stuff i already have in there (one as smb and one as upnp)...

Ohh.. VPN...
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#13
FreddyAV Wrote:Ohh.. VPN...

That is the magic to everything in my setup... Hamachi makes life SOOOOO much easier.. instead of hardcoding paths with port forwarding and using a DNS to IP redirect, vpn just allows you to use workgroups...
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#14
Sorry, Numus, I'm with you all the way on VPN, I just thought you seemed quite negative to VPN stuff in an other thread. Smile
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#15
FreddyAV Wrote:Sorry, Numus, I'm with you all the way on VPN, I just thought you seemed quite negative to VPN stuff in an other thread. Smile

I am negative over the thought of opening and closing different vpn connections based on where data might be stored.. Seems useless when you can have all the systems in the same vpn so the connect never has to be closed...
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